Architect Archive
Thread: Does anyone have hard data on new crafting and harvesters?
Page 1 of 2
Neilla
Wed Mar 10, 2004 7:26 am
#1
I'm having a great deal of trouble finding any solid info on the effects of the publish 7 crafting system on building harvesters. I've heard (variously):
- That you can't build BER 13 heavies any more (I doubt this)
- That you can still build BER 13 heavies but that you use more experimentation points and have nothing left over for hoppers (this seems plausible)
- That its easier to get a single bar up to 100.0%, which might make it possible to make BER 14 (pure speculation on my part).
With things being so uncertain, I'm hedging my bets: I'm making sure that I've got fresh schematics (in case of a severe-to-mild nerf), and I'm holding off on most production (in case we start being able to build BER 14).
If someone had hard info, that would be very helpful.
- That you can't build BER 13 heavies any more (I doubt this)
- That you can still build BER 13 heavies but that you use more experimentation points and have nothing left over for hoppers (this seems plausible)
- That its easier to get a single bar up to 100.0%, which might make it possible to make BER 14 (pure speculation on my part).
With things being so uncertain, I'm hedging my bets: I'm making sure that I've got fresh schematics (in case of a severe-to-mild nerf), and I'm holding off on most production (in case we start being able to build BER 14).
If someone had hard info, that would be very helpful.
Neilla
Thu Mar 11, 2004 10:11 am
#3
Dvnce: Have you seen this? Do you have any info on this? I've noticed that you're buying tons of structure experimentation skill tapes on Gorath... Is there any connection?
Atiw
Thu Mar 11, 2004 3:46 pm
#4
Ok Neilla here we go. I have changed the order of your questions a bit to make it easier for me to answer:
Not true. I can get BER13 harvesters (or BER10's which sell better) just like I got before. In fact it is not much more difficult to make them if you know what to do.
It is MUCH easier to get a single bar to 100% provided that you have good resources, and no, you can not get to BER14 on harvesters (I tries REALLY hard to do that).
Building BER13 or BER10 harvesters with a decent hopper size requires some planning. This is the recipe that I now use to make harvesters on TC.
1. Forget about crafting harvesters by hand one at a time. From now on plan to do all your harvesters as factory runs. This means that you have to set up enough schematics for your subcomponents to do a full run.
2. Make sure that you get the best resources you can find. Resource quality is now EXTREMELY important if you want to have any hope of making max rate harvesters. (If you have to use chemicals, use liquid petrochemicals that lacks the stats we use)
3. Make sure that you can do a couple of schematic experimentation attempts before you make your final schematics.
4. Find a city with Research Centre status and go make your schematics there.
5. If you can afford it get experimentation tapes (I do not have any, so Iworked with my standard 10 points)
The points above is what I found to be the important things to remember. Take all of that into account and now you can start thinking about making harvesters. For the actual crafting of the final products, do the following:
Start making yourself a new schematic for whatever you want, and when you get to the experimentation screen STOP. Take a deep breath, grab a beer (or a soda if you are underage) and get ready for a harrowing experience.
Experiment efficiendy 1 point at a time. The reason for this is that you are hoping to get a couple of great results and 1 or 2 amazings. keep on experimenting untill you hit the BER you are looking for. Once yuo get there, throw the rest of the points into storage. Now create a schematic and use that to make the actual harvesters.
I found that trying to experiment with multiple points at a time was frustrating. I could put 10 points into efficiency and just hit BER13, which left me with a normal hopper.
It seems that it is now harder to make good quality items (this holds true for anything that requires more than one line of experimentation, not just architect stuff). This means that you might find that you have to make 2 or 3 or sometimes more schematics before you find one you like, so you have to plan for that. For harvesters I have not had to try more than 3 times before I got something that was acceptable, my worst experience thus far was trying to make an enhancement pack, which took 11 tries.
To give you an idea of the resource I used for these tests:
Duralloy Steel - UT 984, SR 986, HR 986
Carbonate Ore - UT 940, SR 600, HR 931
I only use liquid petrochem as chemicals since it has no UT,SR or HR.
All pump units, harvesting mechanisms and mining units were experimented to 99% (This is where you can really see the advantages that single line experimentation gets)
I hope this gives you the info you need.
Neilla wrote:
That you can't build BER 13 heavies any more (I doubt this)
Not true. I can get BER13 harvesters (or BER10's which sell better) just like I got before. In fact it is not much more difficult to make them if you know what to do.
Neilla wrote:
- That its easier to get a single bar up to 100.0%, which might make it possible to make BER 14 (pure speculation on my part).
It is MUCH easier to get a single bar to 100% provided that you have good resources, and no, you can not get to BER14 on harvesters (I tries REALLY hard to do that).
Neilla wrote:
- That you can still build BER 13 heavies but that you use more experimentation points and have nothing left over for hoppers (this seems plausible)
Building BER13 or BER10 harvesters with a decent hopper size requires some planning. This is the recipe that I now use to make harvesters on TC.
1. Forget about crafting harvesters by hand one at a time. From now on plan to do all your harvesters as factory runs. This means that you have to set up enough schematics for your subcomponents to do a full run.
2. Make sure that you get the best resources you can find. Resource quality is now EXTREMELY important if you want to have any hope of making max rate harvesters. (If you have to use chemicals, use liquid petrochemicals that lacks the stats we use)
3. Make sure that you can do a couple of schematic experimentation attempts before you make your final schematics.
4. Find a city with Research Centre status and go make your schematics there.
5. If you can afford it get experimentation tapes (I do not have any, so Iworked with my standard 10 points)
The points above is what I found to be the important things to remember. Take all of that into account and now you can start thinking about making harvesters. For the actual crafting of the final products, do the following:
Start making yourself a new schematic for whatever you want, and when you get to the experimentation screen STOP. Take a deep breath, grab a beer (or a soda if you are underage) and get ready for a harrowing experience.
Experiment efficiendy 1 point at a time. The reason for this is that you are hoping to get a couple of great results and 1 or 2 amazings. keep on experimenting untill you hit the BER you are looking for. Once yuo get there, throw the rest of the points into storage. Now create a schematic and use that to make the actual harvesters.
I found that trying to experiment with multiple points at a time was frustrating. I could put 10 points into efficiency and just hit BER13, which left me with a normal hopper.
It seems that it is now harder to make good quality items (this holds true for anything that requires more than one line of experimentation, not just architect stuff). This means that you might find that you have to make 2 or 3 or sometimes more schematics before you find one you like, so you have to plan for that. For harvesters I have not had to try more than 3 times before I got something that was acceptable, my worst experience thus far was trying to make an enhancement pack, which took 11 tries.
To give you an idea of the resource I used for these tests:
Duralloy Steel - UT 984, SR 986, HR 986
Carbonate Ore - UT 940, SR 600, HR 931
I only use liquid petrochem as chemicals since it has no UT,SR or HR.
All pump units, harvesting mechanisms and mining units were experimented to 99% (This is where you can really see the advantages that single line experimentation gets)
I hope this gives you the info you need.
Neilla
Thu Mar 11, 2004 4:27 pm
#6
Thansk you VERY much. This is great news. Its a mild nerf, but I can live with it.
PadreBook
Thu Mar 11, 2004 4:44 pm
#7
Pawlin wrote:Imap, thanks for the report.
Doesn't sound to bad in my opinion.
Yeah we are in the lucky category of crafters!
Padre
RotorofCorRng
Thu Mar 11, 2004 6:57 pm
#8
Well it sounds about what i do now. However, my resoures are not as good as the TC guy. My stell is 930ish, and some 950ish. This allows my mining componentes to get to 96% :/. I have never gone for EXP on hopper size as I hate to go crit and reduced BER. Wonder if those two are still tied together? Oh well, my bank account is big enough to kiss Archi Bye Bye if it becomes a pain to do harvs now. Or I'll stick to making furniture and make billions on candles /sarcasm hehehe.
Dvnce
Thu Mar 11, 2004 7:24 pm
#9
Dvnce: Have you seen this? Do you have any info on this? I've noticed that you're buying tons of structure experimentation skill tapes on Gorath... Is there any connection?
Though the tapes will help.. The timing is just coincidental.. I just happen to be in the mood to spend the money .. ( I am normally a tightwade but I just started a new job in RL that tripled my salary 
so i am feeling a little more frugal )
Yeah .. I still have planed a test that will produce hard numbers.. but it seems that my resource order is getting held up (having special resources made) It will be sad that I have to destroy what i make 
Most of what I have seen is the gap will be widened between those of us that use Premium resources and those that just use above average..
Message Edited by Dvnce on 03-11-2004 06:25 PM
Jedigeneration
Fri Mar 12, 2004 7:39 am
#10
One thing I have found in heavy harvestors of late is that you only need to get 85% efficiency to get the max BER of 13
Medium is the same I think... Might be 90%, (Not made one in a while)
Jackson' Nights
Master Artisan--Master Architect--Master Droid Engineer
Mos Espa, Tatooine, Radiant
Youch1
Fri Mar 12, 2004 7:29 pm
#11
Anyone know if old schematics will still work? I've been using factories for all my heavy/medium harvesters for weeks and weeks and I'm hoping I won't have to replace them 
Skarra, Master Architect
Atiw
Fri Mar 12, 2004 8:49 pm
#12
Old schematics work fine. I have some from before TC got patch 7 and I am still using them
Niklesnitz
Sat Mar 13, 2004 10:00 am
#13
I believe you can hit max rate with 82% final experimentation. This is with 94% mining unit, turbo pump...etc etc.
Jedigeneration wrote:
One thing I have found in heavy harvestors of late is that you only need to get 85% efficiency to get the max BER of 13
Medium is the same I think... Might be 90%, (Not made one in a while)
Jackson' Nights
Master Artisan--Master Architect--Master Droid Engineer
Mos Espa, Tatooine, Radiant
Page 1 of 2