Architect Archive
Thread: *NEW* Architect Ideas Please Give Feedback
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Anoch
Fri Feb 25, 2005 8:55 am
#1
I posted a similar message on the sunrunner forums, but i know some of you wont get to see it. So, im retyping the post to make it a bit more structured.
"Architects....they build houses and furniture and harvesters. Great. But what other use do they have? How can they help the GCW?" Ive heard similar things like that manytimes....i was trying to think of ideas for the architect to spiceup the profession a bit. These are some ideas i have been kicking around , check them out, and post your constructive criticism. Thank you.
City Walls
Walls crafted by Architects that can be placed around a city. They can be split into 3 categories. Military, Decorative, and Generic. Military can be barb wire, steel walls, electric fence, etc. Will depend on the ability of the architect(higher level boxes for better walls). Decorative walls can be Cast iron fences(like some of the old gates in keren), Decorative brick or stucco, etc. Generic could be half height walls such as picket fences, chain link, etc. Walls can be placed like houses are, an overhead view of where you can and cant place them. Could be programmed to work much like planting walls in the sims/sim city. Architects could craft 1 piece that is 500m long or something. The more experimentation the longer the piece?
The walls(depending on the type) will have different uses. The decorative walls will allow add on pieces(gargoyles, lights, etc), and the generic will not allow this and are merely for decoration whereas the decorative have multi uses. ONLY those with zoning rights will be able to place walls and in non factional, non stronghold cities without bases. City walls also will not allow the walls to touch ends....there must be an entrance or gate of some sort(gates explained further down).
The factional walls will all be crafted with hitpoints. Factional walls can ONLY be placed in cities ranked as a 'stronghold', thus giving the actual fortress feel to it. Factional walls may be attacked by any opposite faction special forces player, or a guildmember a war with one of the guilds that are housed in the city limits. Factional walls may also be combined with watch towers(like in the imp outposts), turrets, etc. The 'structure experimentation' of the architect will depend on how many hitpoints the walls will have, thus givingmore of a use to the skill tape.
Doors/Gates
Doors and gates do not have to be fashioned to complete a city wall, however would be recommended.
Generic doors: wood, basic steel, etc. just decoration really.
Decorative: steel grate gates like in theed, garden trellaces, double antique wooden doors, etc.
Security doors: security doors could be used like entry in player structures. Such as, you can have an entry list, and those who enter the door on the entry list will not set off any sort of alarm. Those that ARENT on the entry list either will not be able to enter the door without breaking it down(attack it, like the gates in phase 3 mission at the village), or if its a trap door theyll suffer the effect upon passing the threshold.
security door types: Stronghold(high hitpoint doors), Trap door(depending on resources to craft it, the architect can choose what type of trap. Whatever he chooses will have the comparitive animation andwill do a lot of that type of damage. Such as...poison, fire, disease, electric, blast, etc). Security doors before destroyed could really deter those not on the entry list from forcing entrance into a city alone.
Structure Powerups
Powerups for perishable structures(walls/gates,etc). There can be2 different types(or more, just cant think of any). Resistance and Strength. Structure Resist powerups will allow the ARCH the ability to choose a type of damage the structure will be immune to (energy, kinetic, blast, etc--much like the walls in the trash chute in ep 4). Structure strength pups will allow more hitpoints.
Structure Alarms
Can be placed on ANY type of enterable structure. It will interact with the structures entry list and faction. If the structure owner is imperial and a rebel(on leave, spec forc or combatant) enters the structure, the alarm will "go off" sending a system message to the structure owner. Could also be used on security doors for cities, if anyone not on the security door entry list should attempt to attack or enter the structure, it will sound the alarm.
Demolitions
Architects are skilled at creating buildings, and also know theweakspots to take them out quickly. An architect can craft 'demolitions kits' that, when used by an architect with this skill will take 1/4 thehitpoints of any decayable structure piece away(walls, doors, towers, etc). Can be used like combat meds/grenades, same animation and whatnot. This would give a use to architects in gcw raids.
Possibly also allowing the arch to be able to link land mines around on city walls and hit a simultaneous charge to take out all the walls atonce.
This can also be used on locked containers/doors in dungeons depending on the difficulty level of the piece. Such as if an architect with demolitions were to head into the marauder cave on endor, they could use demolitions kits to blast open thelocked containers. Which, in turn will let smugglers stay true to their illegal weapon slicing activities instead of popping containers for people all the time.
Fashion Transport
we all know we want a multi passenger vehicle. Why not be able to craft the 'shell' of a multi passenger armored transport. The vehicle would also need an armorsmith to craft the armor plating, a weaponsmith to craft the turrets, and an artisan to craft the components to it.
Well, thats about it for now. I know i have more ideas.....but im at work and cant stay on here all day :-)
If a forum manager can please post this on the upper tier id appreciate it, as id like to hear a lot of feedback about the above.
Let me know what you think.
Thanks
Crimsonsplat
Fri Feb 25, 2005 9:28 am
#2
Some of them are new, some aren't. While they're cute and look fun, there are significant issues with all of them.
Anoch wrote:
City Walls
Walls crafted by Architects that can be placed around a city. They can be split into 3 categories. Military, Decorative, and Generic. Military can be barb wire, steel walls, electric fence, etc. Will depend on the ability of the architect(higher level boxes for better walls). Decorative walls can be Cast iron fences(like some of the old gates in keren), Decorative brick or stucco, etc. Generic could be half height walls such as picket fences, chain link, etc. Walls can be placed like houses are, an overhead view of where you can and cant place them. Could be programmed to work much like planting walls in the sims/sim city. Architects could craft 1 piece that is 500m long or something. The more experimentation the longer the piece?
The walls(depending on the type) will have different uses. The decorative walls will allow add on pieces(gargoyles, lights, etc), and the generic will not allow this and are merely for decoration whereas the decorative have multi uses. ONLY those with zoning rights will be able to place walls and in non factional, non stronghold cities without bases. City walls also will not allow the walls to touch ends....there must be an entrance or gate of some sort(gates explained further down).
The factional walls will all be crafted with hitpoints. Factional walls can ONLY be placed in cities ranked as a 'stronghold', thus giving the actual fortress feel to it. Factional walls may be attacked by any opposite faction special forces player, or a guildmember a war with one of the guilds that are housed in the city limits. Factional walls may also be combined with watch towers(like in the imp outposts), turrets, etc. The 'structure experimentation' of the architect will depend on how many hitpoints the walls will have, thus givingmore of a use to the skill tape.
I've seen versions of this idea before, but this one is probably the most developed. There's thingsI like about it, but I'd only allow the mayor to place the walls--if I allowed such an ability, which I wouldn't. Biggest problem I see is exploiting to place the wallsadjacent (note how homes are oftendone that way, despite the footprint). Second biggest problem is that there's nothing to prevent someone from slapping down a new wall instantly to replace a destroyed one.
"Looks like the Imps are about to attack...everyone got their Brandy?"
"Check."
"Buffs done?"
"Check."
"Synthsteak?"
"Check."
"Walls?"
".... ah man, get the Archi in here, I'm fresh out!"
Doors/Gates
Doors and gates do not have to be fashioned to complete a city wall, however would be recommended.
Generic doors: wood, basic steel, etc. just decoration really.
Decorative: steel grate gates like in theed, garden trellaces, double antique wooden doors, etc.
Security doors: security doors could be used like entry in player structures. Such as, you can have an entry list, and those who enter the door on the entry list will not set off any sort of alarm. Those that ARENT on the entry list either will not be able to enter the door without breaking it down(attack it, like the gates in phase 3 mission at the village), or if its a trap door theyll suffer the effect upon passing the threshold.
security door types: Stronghold(high hitpoint doors), Trap door(depending on resources to craft it, the architect can choose what type of trap. Whatever he chooses will have the comparitive animation andwill do a lot of that type of damage. Such as...poison, fire, disease, electric, blast, etc). Security doors before destroyed could really deter those not on the entry list from forcing entrance into a city alone.
Nyet comrade. First, it will change the balance for assualting bases almost as much as the walls. In conjunction with them, forget it. Second they can be used for griefing.
There's absolutely nothing to prevent multiple concentric rings of wals around a base. Remember, you're assuming a concept, but you're creating an ability. It's the ability you have to work with. Professional designers make this mistake all the time; witness the patch to the NPC perk ability to shout, just last night. They concieved of roleplay, but they enabled immaturity.
Structure Powerups
Powerups for perishable structures(walls/gates,etc). There can be2 different types(or more, just cant think of any). Resistance and Strength. Structure Resist powerups will allow the ARCH the ability to choose a type of damage the structure will be immune to (energy, kinetic, blast, etc--much like the walls in the trash chute in ep 4). Structure strength pups will allow more hitpoints.
Got to get around the other issues with walls & doors first.
Structure Alarms
Can be placed on ANY type of enterable structure. It will interact with the structures entry list and faction. If the structure owner is imperial and a rebel(on leave, spec forc or combatant) enters the structure, the alarm will "go off" sending a system message to the structure owner. Could also be used on security doors for cities, if anyone not on the security door entry list should attempt to attack or enter the structure, it will sound the alarm.
Cute, but pointless. I do not want to be spammed by my structures! And as a "city alarm" its dependant on the owner being online. Who owns the city's walls? The mayor?
Demolitions
Architects are skilled at creating buildings, and also know theweakspots to take them out quickly. An architect can craft 'demolitions kits' that, when used by an architect with this skill will take 1/4 thehitpoints of any decayable structure piece away(walls, doors, towers, etc). Can be used like combat meds/grenades, same animation and whatnot. This would give a use to architects in gcw raids.
Weaponmasters and Commandos will hate you for this one. It's not our gig.
Possibly also allowing the arch to be able to link land mines around on city walls and hit a simultaneous charge to take out all the walls atonce.
Commandos will definately hate you for this one.
This can also be used on locked containers/doors in dungeons depending on the difficulty level of the piece. Such as if an architect with demolitions were to head into the marauder cave on endor, they could use demolitions kits to blast open thelocked containers. Which, in turn will let smugglers stay true to their illegal weapon slicing activities instead of popping containers for people all the time.
Ditto above. But I'd like to see them have that ability, with a risk of destroying the items!
Fashion Transport
we all know we want a multi passenger vehicle. Why not be able to craft the 'shell' of a multi passenger armored transport. The vehicle would also need an armorsmith to craft the armor plating, a weaponsmith to craft the turrets, and an artisan to craft the components to it.
Based on skill breakdowns, that's an Artisan concept, even assuming it's ever possible.
Sorry, but no go.
Pawlin
Fri Feb 25, 2005 11:52 am
#3
I think destroyable walls as a GCW item would be OK. It would have to be hard to get them and require faction points though. They'd have to have a weakness and/or be costly.
I think walls for decorative purposes would be fine too. As long as they are made so that you can't make them into inpenetrable lines. Like have gates built into them or something.
Anthemion
Fri Feb 25, 2005 2:24 pm
#4
I think the desire to build fortifications could be mostly delt with by having us involved in the construction of existing faction bases. It would only require organizational changes with no "new" content. Alas, this is not planned.
Just because an idea may not be appropriate for our tree does not make it bad.
Also, I don't think restricted acess areas in player cities is unworkable, but there would be very serious challenges implementing it in a balanced and fair way.
Just because an idea may not be appropriate for our tree does not make it bad.
Also, I don't think restricted acess areas in player cities is unworkable, but there would be very serious challenges implementing it in a balanced and fair way.
Crimsonsplat
Fri Feb 25, 2005 5:07 pm
#5
One note, someone made a suggestion in an independant thread that would make the walls work a little better: The doors/arches are in the MIDDLE. No overlapping the walls by exploit to eliminate the openings.
Ductor_Antares
Fri Feb 25, 2005 8:09 pm
#6
Walls:
Crimsonsplat said that being able to place walls instantly would be a problem. Well I remember a time in Beta when it would take a day or so for just a house to place. The larger and more complex the structure the longer it would take to come into effect. It would show just what you see now for the first few seconds after you place a building before it appears. All the Devs need to do is adjust the settlement timer for walls.
Doors/Gates:
No, too much complexity, will create a lot more lag and stuck people in pvp and normal function.
Structure Powerups:
Against it
Structure Alarms:
Change it to being able to set a structure to being able to not grant access to certain factions, such as ur a rebel and you do not want Imperial shoppers to come into your house shop.
Demolitions:
No our field
Fashion Transport:
Make it so that Master Archs can only build certain things, that Artisians would need to make these vehicles, then Im in agreement.
Tinkergirl
Sat Feb 26, 2005 5:44 am
#7
Regarding the problem with city walls being instantly replaced once destroyed...
Why not have a 'destroyed' stage to the wall. Once it's hit points have been removed, its model is changed to a 'ruined' version, that does not impede movement and a timer starts. This timer (could be 5 minutes or something) would stop the wall from being replaced for those 5 minutes as the 'ruined' version is taking up the space.
That would mean that the attackers would have to time their assaults carefully to coincide with the dropping of a wall and the time before it was buildable again. Just trying to see if it could still work.
Why not have a 'destroyed' stage to the wall. Once it's hit points have been removed, its model is changed to a 'ruined' version, that does not impede movement and a timer starts. This timer (could be 5 minutes or something) would stop the wall from being replaced for those 5 minutes as the 'ruined' version is taking up the space.
That would mean that the attackers would have to time their assaults carefully to coincide with the dropping of a wall and the time before it was buildable again. Just trying to see if it could still work.
Niklesnitz
Sat Feb 26, 2005 10:30 am
#8
While I read these new ideas, nothing really screams out at me.
I liked the city wall idea awhile back, but now I would just see them as obstructions and eyesores of a city. I like the openness of cities.
Structure powerups? There is no excitement to them. Better crafted byArtisan just like weapon powerups. But then again, I don't like the walls and gates idea, so why need them? I liked the idea awhile back of harvester powerups, but again I would give those to Artisans to craft.
Structure alarms! Might be nice for a temporary "neat" factor, but still nothing an elite profession should craft.
Fashion transport? I would like to see multi-passenger vehicles, but do architects really have anything to do with vehicle design? Put it with the other vehicles in the Artisan tree.
Anoch
Mon Feb 28, 2005 12:51 pm
#9
the city walls could look cool ifdone correctly.
we just need more ideas for architects, or else they're just gonna be the same bob vila clones they were before lol
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