Architect Archive

Ok, I know this subject has been run into the ground. It seems that architects are split on if and how decay should be handled. Its time we stopped with the indecision and started making money again.

We have to take into consideration programming.. There are all kinds of "dream" ideas but would require a ton of programming. The devs will ignore ideas like that..

I have given it much thought and there is the only way I think it will work

Housing does not decay. 24 hours after placing a house you can not redeed it.
People do move, When they do they will have to destroy their home and buy a new one.
This will curb the "What do I pay maintenance fees for" question. Houses in real life can last
for hundreds of years if maintained but how many do you see being moved?
(possibly add the ability to "transfer" ownership to someone else making players able to sell
the house instead of destroying it?)

Factories and Harvesters. Do decay over a period of time
Just like any piece of machinery, no matter how much you maintain it, it will eventually fall apart.
There are 2 possibilities here.
1) Whenever a factory or harvester is on, a decay number counts down. Just like weapons with use.
2) The older the structure, the more it costs to maintain. (this would be a pain to keep track of I think)

I'm going to stick with #1

Harvesters going 24x7
Small lasts 1 month
Medium lasts 2 months
Large lasts 4 months

A factory going 24x7 would last 2 months
(not many run at 24x7)

Furniture. No decay just add variety
People won't appreciate furniture disappearing from their house at varied rates.
They will not want to keep up with that. I think the only way to deal with this is
by having the devs make new furniture available over time. There are scads
of models already out there that are used for NPC structures only. People will
want to remodel with the "new fad"

We need to all agree on something that is going to make us money again and push it to the devs. Something like this is feasible programming wise and would have a chance of getting implemented.

What do you think? Would you go for a change like this?What about you Zarcath?

Lets start making money again!

As I have said in one of my other posts.. I'll say here. People don't movemuch and therefore I don't think making houses non-redeedable will solve a lot of our problems. You can do it if you want, I just don't think it will make much difference.

Yes we need some method of 'burning' the structures we have made so that there is always new business requests, rather than relying on the latest person to join the server wanting the stuff.

But what does get moved around a lot ? Harvesters. I don't think decay is the answer for these... and easier and quicker solution is to make all 'business' related structures non-redeedable. People then have to choose between collecting whatever resource pops under their harvester every resource shift, or destroying it and buying a new one to place somewhere more appropriate.

You could make Masters of certain professions (those that actuall use resources for construction maybe) able to re-deed, but that I don't think is critical.

This will not only generate a much large market for our products, but will also add far greater resource trading as say an architect finds their harvesters on an iron source and decide to try their luck harvesting that resource to trade it with a weaponsmith who maybe sitting on a ore spot... or selling on bazaar, to buy what they need off the bazaar, etc.

Heck just make ALL structures non-redeedable if it makes the coding easier !

They could hotfix this in a night !

I am starting to believe that no ammount of changes will sustain the current number of architects.

Nomatter what, change is needed and needed now.Granted, it wont raise architects to the same levels as Armorsmith or Weaponsmith but will generate enough cash to keep them going. The ones that were staying to make loads of cash have pretty much already moved on.. I see less and less architects. Even this forum has slowed.

I am also seeing more and more architects with 4-5 cpu prices and refusing to go lower. Its to the point that when someone needs something, they will pay for it.

I am not criticizing, I agree that changes need to be made if they want architect to be a viable business. But perhaps they do not care if architect is a viable business. The root problem of too many architects will take care of itself if they do nothing.

I am not saying they should do nothing, I am trying to look at it from their perspective. You have to step out of the architect role and out of a player role to do that

Dayln,

This time you are dead right. That may be exactly what SOE is trying to do with the arch profession. Eventually, if they do nothing, the arch population will balance itself out. Enough archs will get sick of having to deal with the business of being an arch and leave. Newbies will be warned to stay out of the arch profession and get into something else. A balance will come. It's just a matter of who will be the archs to stick around during the hard times...to stick it out until the end and be one of those who remains. Will I be one of those? I hope so, but who knows what this game might throw at us. In a month there might be something that changes in my personal life or in-game life that wants to make me move completely away from architecture all together and get back into combat...or maybe another artisan based profession (be it DE, WS, or AS...maybe even merchant selling resources).

I do hate it for all those who are not having fun with the arch profession. Personally, I'm LOVING EVERY MINUTE of it. The ups, the downs...having to deal with suppliers and customers. Having to put some customers off fora bit because of resources and having them understand. It's just a great marriage of fun and really using your mind. And, as I've said before, I'm not in it for the money. I'm in it because I love to craft (whether it be putting together the final combines of completely factory made parts or crafting walls by myself from scratch).

Anian

At some point, I think all archs get tired of building the same stuff over and over. So, make some fun out of things. Rather than being in your house or PA Hall all day every day staring at the same 4 walls, start making deliveries. If someone orders something, hand deliver it rather than asking them to come to you. When you buy resources, try to find a vendor on another planet and go visit that one once in a while.

Maybe offer some kind of trade to your supplier for resources. While you're out delivering (esp if you are in town), keep an ear out for people looking for resources so that you can refer them to your supplier. The more you refer, the better the supplier will be about getting what you need to you at good prices (be it a good resource time or a bad one).

There is SO MUCH MORE to being an arch than just building structures. And if you are getting ALL you need from your PA, then try to stop that maybe and give the other resource vendors a shot. You'll be paying more, but in the end you will be able to get out and explore some...not to mention the fact that you will make new friends and getting access to some MUCH MORE specialized kinds of resources than your PA may be able to provide for ya. And, on the way to your resource vendor, keep an ear out in town for people looking for resources so u can refer them to your supplier and get an even better relationship going.

Anian

I keep thinking aobut the real world, what do we do when no one buys a trasnistor radio anymore, we do nothing, people stop selling them and we buy and sell other stuff.

I am not sure they need to do anything to prop up architect business ( I have flopped all over the page on this subject ) It will sort itself out.

Dayln,

Very good way to summarize it all. I personally don't think anything needs to be done to the arch profession. Let's just give it 6 months and see how many are left. I have a feeling that the balance will come.

Anian

I think Dalyn may have hit the nail on the head: most of arch's problems probably arise from there being too many archs. The ones who get tired of it, or go broke doing it, will leave the game or try another profession. Those that survive will prosper.

Though the demand for structures may decline to a degreeas established characters get their houses and the harvestors they need, there will alwasy be some level of demand for structures. In part this will be due to newbies coming into the game, but I think a larger part of it will be players trying new things. Combat characters may eventually decide to give crafting a try, meaning they'll need shops, factories, generators and harvestors. Established crafters may decide to go into new crafting professions, necessitating a new set of equipment, or they may decide to expand their businesses. And there will be the occasional character who forgets to put maintenance in a structure and it will burn down, so they'll have to get a replacement (admittedly, this would be rare).

I know structure decay sounds great from an Architects viewpoint, but you need to look at it from a player's viewpoint as well. If someone just got a house as either a luxury item or a storage unit, and it burns down in a month or two no matter what they do, they'll simply stop buying houses. Why spend 1,000's of credits on something that is, at best, a glorified bank deposit box when it's going to disappear in a month?

Likewise, why spend over a 100,000 credits for fusion generators or heavy extractors if you can't redeed them or if they will also burn down no matter what? All you'll be doing is shooting yourself in the foot; structure demand will drop like a rock.

What will revive architecture and make it a long-term profession is structure experimentation (I know this has been mentioned many, many times before, but it's so true that it bears repetition). When architects can differentiate the structures they make, as most other crafters can differentiate their products fromthose of another crafter, then that will give people a reason to buyan improved heavy mineral extractor or a more efficient factory.

In addition, I think archs could use a few more things to sell. Someone mentioned NPC furniture, and I think this would be great to add for archs. But I have also seen verandas, fountains, gardens and similar things spawn as camps on Rori (so the models for these things exist as well). I would gladly pay for a veranda and a nice fountain to place around my house (and I would gladly give up a land lot to place them as well). These kind of proprerty improvements, while non-functional, I think would be very popular becausethey would allow people to personalize their residences. Also, they could help to keep others from planting harvestorson their doorsteps.

Slim Vargo, Corbantis

I always enjoy ideas. I thank the contributor for efforts aimed at helping this difficult profession, but I have concerns regarding decay in structures. We already pay maintenance fees for upkeep. I maybe more agrreeable if the powers-that-be did away with the fees in lieu of ultimate decay and equipment replacement. As an architect who owns structures of all kinds, I don't want the additional headache of replacement, moving inventory, and scrambling for a lot (or keeping the one I have). The fix needs to come in earlier on in professional development, such aslot restrictions in the non-artisan players which may help control some of the undercutting from heavily backed newbies. Lots to non-artisans would be deeded in houses up to 10 lots. They may even have a few open lots....but I feel there is where the answer may lie. Maybe crafting of installations should require skill pre-reqs......especially larger equipment. No more Installations 4 then nothing else needed. Maybe the worthless construction branch could come in handy here. When it is tough to rise to the level you achieve, selling low is not an attractive option. The precious skill points do mean alot!

As far as skills, I certainly do not want to see this go to the extreme of weapons, where only top tier and masters are financially viable. I cannot blame newbiesfor being attracted to the field, but it should be clear early on that they cannot afford to undercut. The stressmay weed out many early on without as much agony. Just my two credits and my unswerving feeling for today at least! (:<

Great post.

Non-Redeedable Buildings. Something I have always avocated. The key here is that servers get to a certian point where no new deeds are needed. This is true of both houses and factories. People do move around and do upgrade their houses. The upgrade house options has all but flooded the market with smalls. People join new PAs and move or they change professions. Non-redeedable factories would help create new demand as people move or change professions. As it is once enough factories deeds are out, their isn't much need for fresh deeds. Not sure if I like decay or not. Maybe make it so you have 1000 runs on a given factory before it stops working. At that point you need to clean it out and get a new one. Having it go poof with items inside is just griefing by poor game design. This is also true for housing.

Housing Decay. Bad bad idea. Can you imagine the day your PA hall or large house needs to be changed out. What is the point? It is a whole lot of nothing and not why people play this game. Game play is key in any game, housing decay doesn't promote good game play. Some form of consumable, such as a housing power up the reduces cost of maintenance may be a better option.

Redeeding on Harvesters. This is a great oppertunity to make experimentation matter. Harvesters should be given a redeed limit, like charges. Personals should only have 1 to 3, mediums 4 to 8 and larges 9 to 15. The variability comes in the experimentation and people will pay more of harvesters with higher redeed charges. There will always be a market for new harvesters as peoples charges will run out, and yet this allows people to move their harvesters.

Furniture. It serves no purpose other than looks, and something that is just going to fall apart that takes up storage space is simply not going to be in demand. New furniture while phasing out the old stuff is a great way to keep this fresh.

Redeeding of harvesteres with a certain 'charge limiit' is a good idea, except that a few charges with the unpredictable resource shifts will hurt US! I do not relish the thought of making more larges for myself every few shifts! We are quantity resource dependent as it is. I would still rather see that the many non-artisans be limited on the larges, if any, they can own. Make mining a trade that is skill point hungry. If a non-crfater wants to mine, then the choice is obvious...pony up the skill points, or deal with a harvester 'charge limit', or leave the profession alone. Yes...I like the choices!

I like the idea of houses being 'fixed'. You want to upgrade? The destroy your old structure in order tosalvage a great site. Better yet, sell the lot whole in a /transferstructure move. I can see that realestate is getting important. I look at venders' row at Theed and sse the lots being 'reserved' with worthless mining equipment.