Architect Archive

First the idea, then the reasons for the idea, then the implementation. First all of it in brief for those that missed their Ritalin, then in a bit more depth on the reasons for the obsessive-compulsives
While I will touch on the impact of marketing for the movie/expansion and the CU on the player base that's not what this thread is about. It's about a co-ordinated business plan do deal with effects of those things. Regardless of whether we think they're good or bad, it should be obvious to all that the player base is in for some changes, it's only a question of scale which we're not getting into here.

The Idea
Let's form a cartel on each server!

The Reasons

-The ROTS/ROTW marketing campaign(s) WILL bring in new players. Perhaps still more in a few months if it really is being ported to console.

- Existing players WILL be leaving/changing professions in significant numbers.

(For both of these points how many doesn't matter, lets just agree it will be more than a few in both instances).

-The new relative-level combat system WILL impact our business as many who harvest non-creature resources now won't be able to as easily if at all.

- The new schematics (particularly for armoursmith) WILL have a significant impact on supply/demand/pricing for resources.

End results: Resource prices are headed for orbit. There will be lots of our products for sale used for much less than we sell for. There will be an increased demand for all our products (at least for a couple months) but especially harvesters.

The Implementation

We'll need a volunteer from each server to co-ordinate things. I'm willing to do it for Bloodfin but won't object if someone else wants to take on the task as (at least to start) it will be a fair bit of time committment to get going. How much people are willing to work together for the betterment of all in our profession will likely vary server-server but I'll make some suggestions:
- Setting a minimum price for at least deeds if not furniture.
- Ensuring clearance-priced used items that we craft get bought by an architect for re-sale.
- We all need a large volume of resources, if you find someone unloading and don't have enough $ to buy them out, share the WP with others.
Yes, I know there's other things we can do as well, I stopped at 3 deliberately and I'd ask you not to include additional ones in replies. Instead send them to me as a PM. I will add all serious ones I receive (OK maybe a couple joke ones), whether I favour them or not, in a day or two. I just want to get as many original ideas as possible without peoples train of thought being influenced by others, we should get a greater variety of ideas this way. Then once we have co-ordinators, each server can debate which ideas they agree on or not rather than all of us having to come to a single consensus.

The Reasons Expanded

-The ROTS/ROTW marketing campaign, possible console port WILL bring in new players (let's not get into how many or for how long or if the port is going to happen). This will eventually lead to an increase in demand for all of our products. Some will take up crafting, a significant increase in people grinding and building inventories. End result: (at last for a month or two) resource shortage/increased prices combined with increased demand for all our products as they become established economically in the game.

-People leaving/re-skilling in significant numbers.
We've all seen the going-out-of-business and leaving-game sales. The increase in these (already noticeable on my server) will put considerable amount of used deeds and furniture at clearance prices. Already at least once a week I buy 8 or more heavy minerals at 75k or less. MOST heavy water on the Bloodfin GWVS are now going for 50-60k with the doctors not crafting anymore. When I started playing in January (ie as people left for WoW) my first 6 harvesters all cost me 100k and had 80-120k of BOTH maint and power still in them!
With an increase in these sales the prices should drop even lower because these people just want them out of their inventory. These sellers already got their money's worth out of them, even 1 credit for a heavy is just gravy to them. End result: for those of us who do now or, after the CU will have to, buy resources we could quickly reach a point where used prices drop below resource costs for production. Even if you gather your own, it could be forget about profit or have 0 sales at the prices you have now.

- The CU WILL impact our business as many who harvest now won't be able to as easily if at all, Short term this means a noticeable drop in resource gathering. Increase in resource prices due to shortage, probably to a point ABOVE our current retail prices for structures, nevermind competing with the used prices mentioned above. Once new players, and combat-profs pick up (some of?) the harvesting slack they may well normalize within a couple months but for that to happen they'll need harvesters, and lots of them. End result: (at last for a month or two) resource shortage and increased prices combined with increased demand for harvesters.

- By now I'm sure you all know the armoursmiths are in turmoil. The stats they need are being changed and that means most of their resource stockpiles will now be worthless for their use and if they haven't already been sold off they likely will soon. On my server all but 2 of the large volume armoursmiths and several of the smaller guys have already started, in some cases finished, their leaving-game/going-out-of-business-to-change-professions sales.
It's still not clear if armour will be useful at all, but if it is then there will be a shortage of armour, New people will take up the trade and be buying lots of resources for grinding. New and old armoursmiths alike will be building resource stockpiles with the new stats they need. Amount of resources used for armoursmiths to make each suit is increasing 300%. (Think about if that happened to US /SHUDDER). This will be bigger than all the newbs grinding, an entire profession trying to stockpile 3x as many resources as they had before, from scratch. End result, increased demand for resources, again leading to further increase in costs for those amongst us that don't/can't harvest all of their own needs.

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SonOfAGhost wrote:
- Setting a minimum price for at least deeds if not furniture.

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Pawlin wrote:

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SonOfAGhost wrote:
- Setting a minimum price for at least deeds if not furniture.

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So what prices? I think the biggest hurdle to setting up such a system is agreeing on the price. If we all agreed on prices we wouldn't be in the situation we are right now.

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Quite right. That's why I suggested doing it on a server-by-server basis and only the minimum price. Less people to bring to agreement and the...ummm...premium sellers can still charge what they want. Just like OPEC. If grind resources make it as high as 5 CPU (just to pick a number) even the undercutters will need to come up to some extent. If not, they're a lot easier to keep out of stock if 10 architects are buying them out not just one or two.
Please bear in mind for this to be effective we don't need everyone, or even most people, just most of the supply. As long as the folks with bigger inventories work together we can limit the effects of the aforementioned market forces that are beyond our control.

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Pawlin wrote:

Ok, so on my server people sell for:

55k, 75k, 79k, 85k, 100k

How do you think we should set the minimum price?

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Exactly. It's an interesting idea, but it would never work. There are too many Architects (like me ) who are too independent and will never join in.

Message Edited by Jutewr on 04-22-2005 05:15 PM

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Elyssa wrote:

I don't sell anything for less than 6cpu (unless I buy it at a wholesale price).

Anything less is a waste of my time.

Most things are higher based on demand.

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Oh wow... I wish I could charge that much. I sell just enough right now and I dont think that balance would last if I increased my prices to that level. However, I may try it on an item or to and see if tey sell.

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Jutewr wrote:

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Pawlin wrote:

Ok, so on my server people sell for:

55k, 75k, 79k, 85k, 100k

How do you think we should set the minimum price?

Well the 55k individual is an obvious target for buyout but it's only fair to invite them first anyway. The middle 3 aren't far apart and once they realize what's coming it's not likely to take much convincing for them to increase. Whether by sharing my points above, keeping them bought out or that they start losing money as resource costs go up. The 15k gap to 100 shows they clearly want to make a profit and should be eager to participate

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Exactly. It's an interesting idea, but it would never work. There are too many Architects (like me ) who are too independent and will never join in.

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So don't, wait to raise your prices until you're losing money due to immensely increased costs. Personally I think customers will have less "sticker-shock" with gradual increases then an abrupt "OMG I can't afford to sell at this price anymore" increase, particularly since some already sell at much higher prices (Elyssa I'm jealous, I've been nudging my prices up towards 4 CPU, but at least my costs are lower than most, but that's another thread when I can find time). Yes we are an independent lot, probably most crafters are, it's not exactly a group activity Remember to that the expeted influx of new players won't know what passed for normal prices up to this point.

Because of our independent and competitive natures I'd be surprised if any cartels survive 6 months. My intent was merely to create a consortium of convenience to survive the short term upheavals I outlined. As I said, a majority of architects is not required, merely a majority of supply. There are dozen's of architects on Bloodfin, maybe even 100, but that majority of supply can probably be achieved with just 5 or 6 of us in the middle of the price range. Most architects stock less than 50 deeds. Close to 1/2 have less than 25. Probably 1/3 of the profession are at the high end (I saw a large house for 350k yesterday ) and already meet whatever minimums a cartel may try to agree on. Most are also in our current middle-range and 5 or 6 selling at close to cost and should be easily bought out by a cartel of 1/2 dozen larger volume dealers if they choose not to participate.

From what I've seen most casual players are NOT on the GWVS. I haven't made a small house since I mastered, buy them all from a guy selling for 5k who's not listed. Currently heavy moistures are down to 50-60k as people try to clear them with doctors not crafting anymore. I'm assuming BE or CM will have new/increased use for water with their additional crafting but just don't know it yet. What led to this proposal was finding out how easy it was to buy up ALL the 50-60k heavy waters showing on the GWVS, in under an hour, by myself, on Corellia, Tatooine, Talus and Lok (planets I was visiting anyway) If I can alter the market that easily for 1 product by myself in a short time, a cartel as outlined can and will work. Particularly when the market forces described are working at the same time to dry up supply and increase costs/prices. The goal is not permanent control of the market, rather it is ensuring the survival and stability of our businesses through a period of major change. If a server cartel survives even 3 months I would consider it to be a complete success. Maybe we'll be lucky and there won't be a big upheaval and the cartels will fall apart within 2 weeks, but I'm not that optomistic.

Message Edited by Zhundult on 04-24-2005 06:11 PM