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Thread: What does the Smuggling Community want from the Smuggler Revamp?
Pick-pocket : Simple enough. Since Smugler is the Theef style class in SWG it only makes since for them to be able to do such a thing. It seems to be an Underworld skill. It has pc to pc posibilities (TEF when failed).
Source of Income : I know poeple are in debate on how to add smugling into the game. I don't belive you can set up a pc to pc smugling system that would work. A mission based system seems like a good direction to go. I don't know if anyone has said this yet, but ..... If you do a mission based system and there is some kind of illigal good being moved from NPC to NPC. It should be in some form of locked container, it should raise your TEF with local police (skill Mod), the container should be sliceable, and PC bounties should be placed on failer. Reward should be the mission payout that was failed.
How to Fail : 1) The police catch you and death blow you. Mission over and cargo is lost.2) container is slice, transfered, or placed on the bazaar. Traveling into Starports with high risk goods can give a TEF do to customs.
The containers should contain credits, spice, art, schamatics. Items people want and not 1 unit of metal and a CDF pistol. (Though there should be a differnce between the containers already in game and the new ones.)
Travel : Smuglers should be able to slice travel terminals. It is in the nature of a smugler to travel a lot, and by now, they should know of means to do so without paying. More so to give the idea that they have snuck onto the ship to aviod detection then anything else (master ability).
Greetings all,
The idea of “Experimentation” seems to be a rather hot one because there are a lot of people, like myself who do not want to have to spend hours and hours running all over the Galaxy looking for the best resources and dropping harvesters… this however is an aspect to the game that allows in many ways the rewards of actually spending the time and skill points to level so… what if the spice and underworld line ran hand in hand, what if each level of underworld allowed access to or better worded “a contact with” an NPC representative of one of the “crime families” who may or may not have a line on some “raw spice” of some kind, this idea has been sort of put forward before but I don’t recall seeing anyone trying it in with the underworld line before. Once we get the “raw materials” to make a spice that we are capable of making we then “cut” it down for resale, and either hand craft it or dump it in a factory and let it run… the quality of the product would then depend on two issues, the level of the smugglers spice skill, (in the cutting down process) and the quality of the original raw material (which is largely determined by two things, firstly the randomness of resources spawn much like the crafters have to deal with, and our level of underworld skill and the contacts we have.) This would allow those smugglers who have worked all the way to master to have a distinct advantage over dabblers and newer smugglers who have only worked to spice 4, in that they would have access to far better underworld contacts to get far better product to begin with… (sorry long paragraph)
The Imperial Scans… while I see the issue some people have with high ranking imperial officers have with accessing smuggler skills just by gaining faction points, I would point out the idea that perhaps there is another way to look at this, what I would like at least (as I can only speak for myself) is the idea of being a smuggler… I don’t really care if an imperial can carry spice without fear, my goal is to have that level of fear myself thus adding some adventure to my gaming experience, to that end I would say that the scans should be done only for “raw materials” of contraband items which would only be used or obtained by Smugglers. If we look at the real world, the cops care far more about the dealer / distributor of drugs than they do the user for the most part so, add the TEF to possession of raw materials (that would include clamps and laser knives as well) and make a whole other system that involves the GCW. It would seem to me that for the empire being a contraband dealer and being a rebel would be two different issues.
As for the dirty fighting line I honestly have not made it up that tree yet so it is hard for me to say what does and does not need to work so I will gladly defer to those with more knowledge there.
Greetings all,
i just want to smuggle... i've wanted to smuggle since 1977 (ok... i was born in '77 but you get the point 
). thats all. there are 4 pages of posts giving the details of how to accomplish this, so i'm not going to retype it all, just want to add one more voice to make the point. and no... terminals for NPC deliveries is not what i want. as mentioned, i want to have a role that interacts with players and where i am needed (maybe not needed, but very heavily desired).
being able to be more of a rogue than just a guy with (Rouge) over his head would be nice too
oh, and throw us a bone and give us some kind of combat modifier... i only have smuggler skills and an assortment of other base level skills and man... all i get are level 9 missions on corellia solo even though i can solo tougher creatures. all i want is a little bump...
2. Make it so the last 3 boxes of underworld give something. Mine were blank making it so fun to train
3. Some kind of skill at master smuggler besides improved slicing Feign Death could be a master skill (again blank)
Mostly some pistol mods so not every smuggler needs to be a pistoleer or TKA to be worth a crap in pvp.
thanks
I started replying to this thread, then realized I was just rewording the same thing I said in another post. It would be easier to just re-post it. This is from TH's In-Concept thread:
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Underworld
Currently the underworld needs more skills and more of a feel. What "underworld" type of underworld skills do you think smugglers should have?
The Underworld tree needs more crime, roguish behavior, and overall dirtiness. Throw us an Unarmed special move or two (Eye Gouge? Trip? Quick Escape?), add a dash of Stealth (can get past aggressive NPCs, can do all missions of opposite faction, including Theme Parks), sprinkle in some GCW love (make factional bases tougher, and give Smugglers more stuff to slice, including security doors and control terminals, maybe even slice into the security panel and knock out the turrets for a short while).
Do you like the idea of an underworld tree?
Yes, and it is a bit better since the crackdown, but making Imps better Smugglers than us is a bit of a kick in the pants. Its not like we get AT-STs to make up for their gain. 
The Underworld tree done right could really turn us into the Smugglers we dream of playing, and not just the slicing spicers that we currently are.
If you don’t like the idea of an underworld tree, what would you prefer?
I like it, it just needs some work.
Spices
The spices have been balanced and tweaked a bit, so they should function properly. Given that, should spices be added so that more professions would have a genuine need and desire for spices or should they remain more of a roguish game element?
Spices that give a bigger advantage should be added, but they should come with possible dangerous side-effects. When I say "possible," I mean, taking this Muon Ultra too often may have the unexpected side effect of making you Dizzy for twenty minutes (maybe once out of every ten uses) ON TOP of the downer.
What do you like about spices?
I like that, when used correctly, they can turn a sure death into a "holy hell I made it" escape.
What don’t you like about spices?
Experimentation doesn't work.
What would you like to see with spices?
I would like to be able to be the best Fence out there, and be able to make spices with a shorter downer, or a longer or better boost, etc, then the next guy. The stats of our materials need to matter, and the experimentation needs to matter. Then, and only then, can we raise our prices and become the Say Hello To My Little Friend druglords that we could be.
Slicing
What should be the benefit gained by slicing?
Slicing should serve the current functions that it has, but we should have some way of improving our odds. When slicing armor, I would love to take a spice that improves my chances of an encumbrance slice, for example.
What other types of items would you like to see "slice-able"?
Sliced swoops should go faster, sliced droids should have more storage space, have a higher rating, decay faster, and possibly go haywire and change personalities. Slicing the Bank Terminal should get you a measly 100 credits, and a TEF to all planet security forces regardless of faction for an hour (hehe OK, maybe only I would find that fun).
What slicing activities would you like to be involved in?
PC Factional bases should have doors and levels, whose doors either need to be blown to pieces (timely), or unlocked by a Slicer (quickly). NPC factional bases should have locked rooms or vaults with something on the other side of the door, be it lootable items inside, or an pack of rabid slice hounds that instantly devour you. Make it a gamble, but a worthwhile one.
Dirty Fighting
Should ground based smugglers be a "combat profession" or remain a hybrid?
Hybrid. The dirty fighting tree is great, but we could use some Pistol Mods. I suggested some Unarmed moves in the Underworld tree, as it needs more work, but they could be added here too.
What should be the reason why other players want to have a Smuggler in their hunting group?
Locked containers, safes, vaults, etc. should be more common in the game, and contain one time use "buff" items and power-ups in them. Then having us around to slice them would pay off. The current bonus to avoid detection for illegal items is a major boost, and I love ya for it, but we could use more. On top of the terminal slicing boost, any group that doesnt want us around is, to be blunt, stupid.
How should a Smuggler fair in Player versus Player combat?
We shouldn't be the most powerful combat class, but the dirty tricks we have up our sleeve should always keep us competitive. One on one, a smart Smuggler SHOULD be able to take on anyone, at least some of the time. I think we're in good shape as is, but should either have better aim (pistol bonus to hit), or be harder to hit (defense bonus).
What role would you like to see smuggler play planet-side? What does it mean to "smuggle" in terms of raw gameplay in the ground game?
There should be some items only available on some planets, and anyone bringing them off the planet will get attacked by the uber-guards at the starport. Trying this should be a suicide mission.
Smugglers should do this all the time, as they would have a bonus to evade, a bonus that NO ONE else has, not even the Emperor's little shoe shiners.
What kind of grouping interdependencies should smugglers have?
Smugglers should not be needed, but should be useful through the smuggling illegal items bonus, the mission terminal bonus, the shorter downer time bonus (oh, did I not mention that one hehe), etc.
What is the reason player groups will want to have smugglers with them?
The reasons mentioned throughout this post.
What combat advantages should Smugglers give player groups?
None.
What non-combat advantages should Smugglers give player groups?
A bonus to avoid detection from hostile NPCS.
just to add my opinion (since I'm a Smuggler and it is my Main Profession):
Spices:
- Spice Experimentation should work already (option to craft enhanced spices would greatly improve the spices branch)
- a new spice for the Master Box (combination of Muon and Pixie would make a interesting addition)
Slicing :
- would be great to notice a bit more of a improvement for Masters over Slicing4 besides the slightly higher top results.
Master should be able to make at least a decission which stat he is attempting to improve (speed/dmg/encumber/effectiveness).
- Containers (or Slicing1 grind food) should content worthwhile items more regulary.
- Terminal slice should't only enhance the profit on the first page of a mission terminal, a set duration (15 sec +50%fora Master?would make the skill more interesting. or how about slicing a terminal for a group?
Dirty Fighting:
- nothing much to add for this branch really but I would like to see the DF moves unarmed combat skills (TKA)
either. (or I gladly take the skillpoints used for brawler/unarmed4 back which I had to spent for novice Smuggler).
Underworld:
unless you manage to make a life by selling FP every day (which isn't the case for most smugglers) the Underworld
section isn't really appealing at all and of no interest for Neutral players.
however, I would like to see a different type of experience (lets call it "general smuggler exp") for this banch.
to the that exp the smuggler should actually get some "underworld type" jobs (smuggler mission terminals anyone?).
actually thinking about something like the Investigation branch for BH (without the bugs).
well that's it most likely, sure I got more Ideas but guess it is enough for now...
a) Smuggler Vendors - Smuggler Vendors are the only ones capable of carrying Spices and Sliced Weapons, as well as other "illegal" pieces of kit (signal recordings?)
b) Smuggler Trainers - GET THE SMUGGLER TRAINERS OFF THE STREETS! - the only place you should be able to get trained in smuggling should be in a Smugglers Den, and you should have to be led there (read: inducted/vouched for by) another Smuggler.
c) Smuggler Mission Terminals - see point 4 for how Smuggler Missions should work.
Basically, a Smugglers Den should be like a Speakeasy - somewhere that is *officially* a personal dwelling or tea-room, but is actually a den of Spices and cut weapons. Think "Fat Tony's Legitimate Businessmans club" - you know it makes sense.
The Smugglers Den should ONLY appear on your overhead map as such if you have certain skills - the Underworld Line from Smuggler or the Investigation line from Bounty Hunter.
Having to Slice the Door to get in wouldn't hurt either
2) Sliding scale of SAF - that's "Suspicious Activities Flag" - this idea should work with the Imperial crackdown - give different values to different illgal activities - carrying 1 charge of a Minor Spice (giggledust) gives you a SAF of 1. Harder Spices give more SAF points. A Sliced Weapon is 5. A full suit of Sliced Weapons and Sliced Armour is a LOT. Wearing/wielding the items makes it more likely that they will be noticed by the authorities.
Having a low SAF means that you are "under observation" - perhaps give Bounty Hunters tracking missions to follow the suspect, and anyone the Bounty Hunter reports as being in contact with the suspect (trading with them or teaming with them) gets a minor (1 point) SAF.
Higher SAFs mean that you are increasingly under suspicion by the authorities - your effective faction rating is negatively altered (so fully paid up members of one faction are temporarily treated as having lesser status, and perhaps cannot buy faction perks (at high enough SAF) - at very high SAFs your faction affliiation may not be enough to save you from hostile action - and an attendant fine and loss of your illegal goods.
SAF decreases gradually over time that you are not observed breaking any laws. Perhaps Bounty Hunters can scan you and use their contacts to tell you just how much of a SAF you have? Also, some of the Image designer abilities that alter your features reduce your SAF faster
3) Secrecy - attendant to the SAF line, the secrecy of the Smugglers Den should have a value - when it becomes 0 the place is *blown* (temporary or permanent, depending on how you want to make it work), and things therein are disabled or lost. The Secrecy of the Smugglers Den affects what level of Underworld and/or Investigation is required to find it on the (CTRL-M) map (maybe on CTRL-V too?). Possibly higher levels of Underworld allow you to run missions with greater effects to improve secrecy - see point 4
4) Smuggler Missions - The dodgy geezer in the Smugglers Den can let you know about certain "business opportunities" - guy downtown needs someone to carry a consignment to Jaxuk over the river. Leave the smugglers den, find the first guy, speak to him, get the consignment (and with it an increase of a random ammount of SAF - you never know just how hot the consignment is going to be), take it to the buyer and recieve your cut - along with a possible additional ammount of SAF - because the buyer might be being watched too.
Other Smuggler Missions could have an effect to the Secrecy of the Smugglers Den you take them from - say you have to draw attention to another building in town by dropping off faked consignments there - this type of mission should spawn randomly, and will increase your own SAF, but make the Den more secret
Smuggler Missions should be from an NPC, not a term (no smuggler trusts a term - we know they can be sliced too easily), and should vary in the type available by how much Underworld skill you have.
5) Spices - Spices should be subject to the same sale restrictions as Sliced items. They should only be for sale directly from a Smuggler or in a Smugglers Den.
See this page for the rest of my opinion regarding Spices
http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=smuggler&message.id=63547&page=3
6) The Underworld line - The Underworld Line should have it's own form of xp (hear me out people) - but this can only be got from the Smuggler's Den. Basically, Underworld xp happens when you use your other skills to the benefit of the Underworld - it works more like faction points than true xp. You can take the option of making any Mission from the Smuggler's Den mission giver an "Underworld Mission" (or possibly you could have a special tab in the mission list), which are missions to work for the underworld - the "improve Secrecy" missions, ones to eliminate a smuggler who is breaking ranks or who is a threat (which could be what Greedo was doing going after Han), negotiation jobs, "lead a new contact to the Den" missions, and others - use your imagination. Another possibility is that you could trade some other forms of XP for underworld XP (pistol, spices, slicing, merchant)
7) Make the requirements Marksman: Pistol4 and Artisan: Business 4 - Maybe Ranged Support or Engineering as well, but NOT Brawler
8) make Feign Death actually work against players.
9) Theives Cant - an addition to the Underworld line. Create an additional language that is only available to Smugglers in the Underworld Tree. The +100 language comprehension is worthless now anyway, but thieves cant is an old and good facet of a criminal underworld.
10) Make both Weapon Slicing and Spice creation function as fun subgames - Slicing could easily be made into a fun logic game (with "circuit paths" and "overrides" to be altered) - and different items of equipment that must be used for different effects.
Spice creation, as noted in the other post, needs to do different things. In particular, you need to make the lower level spices worth something by giving them diffent effects (different downsides that don't involve the cliched negative stats and puking - some should do Black Wounds, other negatives to all accuracy, others ruin your dodges on the comedown (or better yet while you are up) - not all Drugs have come-downs, some should have negative and positive while on the Up)
I think that is all for now - i'll let you know if I think of any more
Other things: A replacement for the horrid container grind, and a method of using Slicing in normal missions (cutting the comm lines by using a one-time jammer?) which reduces the level of adds, or something like that - basicaly giving us a way of USING slicing, not just grinding it.
Slicing the the bazaar, machine vendors and doors too - don't reduce the money other players get (that would be unfair to them), but let the smuggler slice the entry terminal to trick the galactic central banks credit scanner into taking less from him/her than it pays to the recipient.
And illegal Spice ingredients, that can be used by other professions (Medic, Doc, Combat medic the most) to make more effective stims and suchlike - give us a client market for specialised stuff, you know?