Rifleman Archive
Thread: Hitting the unhittable templates
Message Edited by YarKi on 02-05-2004 08:24 AM
YarKi wrote:
So I have afew questions for those that understand the system better than I do.
Disclaimer: This is a really nasty grey area. The devs haven't told us jack about how the combat mod system works (I guess to try to limit manipulation of it). For example, we had to figure out speed mods anecdotally. No one that I know has ever clearly presented data on how defense and accuracy mods work. My answers below are my guesses/assumptions, along with explanations of what lead my thinking.
1. The ranges listed as 65/50/0 (or so)does that mean that the first mod applies in 65-50 band, the second in 50-0 and the lastat point blank?Or is it first one is at 65, second one at 64-50 and the last at 50-0?
A. I believe the mods show the scale ranges. In other words, target a mob in pve at max range. see the modifier. move forward 3 m, and the modifier scales. So, you have modifier A at 0, and modifier B at 50. your accuracy scales at a rate determined by mod B-mod A from 0 to 50 (and i'm not sure if it's a linear scale). then, from 51 to 64, your accuracy will scale by a rate determined by Mod C (65) - Mod B (50). Does that make sense?
2. Exatly how does the accuracy bonus and aiming bonus and the target defense affect the overall chance to hit.
A. I assume its an adversarial proportion. In other words, you pit your current accuracy with that weapon at that range against the targets ranged defense (first) and secondary defense (dodge, etc). Your accuracy is affected by movement, stance, etc also. Aiming bonus is for use with the /aim command, i'm assuming.. Accuracy is your base chance to hit.
3. Related to the one above - does it make sense to go for master marksman for the extra +10 rifle accuracy?
A. Can't hurt. The problem here is that we don't know how significant +10 accuracy really is. +5 speed at Master Marksman is easily defined as a huge benefit, since we know how rifle speed works. I'd get MM for the speed bonus, and consider the accuracy increase as a fortunate side effect.
4. Does it pay to get a rifle with experimented range bonuses and does it pay to get a range bonus powerup
A. I haven't done it, but i've heard of other Master Sharpshooters who have. If you did that, I'd have that weapon hotkeyed. Switch to it against a defense dabbler, but have your normal damage sliced/powered weapon available for normal pvp.
I
Xors great idea and I was about to tell him to get a laser rifle with an advanced scope. Ya the stun should work and an Advanced Scoped laser rifle should get that first hit, also if you can get some Dead Eye serum it can't hurt.
Those are my ideas.
my limited understanding of how things work....
the first task is getting past their primary ranged defense. this can be done with /aim and an accurate gun.
the combat spam should show a hit/miss as a result. the second task is putting a state on them that drops their primary *and* secondary defenses, which ordinarily are stacked to the point that every single shot will be effectively blocked/dodged/etc.
once you have the stun state on them, then their stacked primary and secondary defenses go down, allowing actual damage to be done.
if i got that wrong, someone let me know, it's confusing as hell to me. i guess it's moot anyway, since the stacking is being fixed.... i'd still like to know though.
XaverriJade7 wrote:
Right, get yourself a nice scoped weapon. For those 'unhittables' (They don't really exist) just lay prone as in this case it's ok (Who would've thought THAT would happen in PvP?!?). Try to get as close to ideal range as possible. You should hit just fine without /aim. However, it will certainly help if this guy has high Dodge/Counterattack or whatever. And yes I do mean BOTH Dodge and Counterattack as you should not have a problem with Dodge stackers at ideal range while prone.
As a rule I never go Prone in PVP at master. Maybe it is just me, but I never have a problem hitting the Temploiters with /aim. And If they have Master Brawler going prone makes it too easy for one to burst to you and get a KD in. Lunge 2 = 20 meter static KD up to 30 meters if running. I prefer not to get into that situation.
-J
Stun works wonders. If its a fencer/pistol guy going fencer and has a macro to stay centerd the whole fight you may want to /burstrun. I have fired 100+ flushing shots at one and not landed a single shot. Lucky not many peeps do this.
Evis Shroomtip
Griegette wrote:
I would stack 2 aims before trying going prone
Errr...can you even do this? Never tried. And I still wouldn't go prone. It's just asking for a melee to run up and KD/Dizzy you.
-J
XaverriJade7 wrote:
Right, get yourself a nice scoped weapon. For those 'unhittables' (They don't really exist) just lay prone as in this case it's ok (Who would've thought THAT would happen in PvP?!?).
i don't agree at all. most of the defense stackers are TKM, plus Fencer.
going prone in pvp against a melee type is the same as meekly accepting death.
also, for the ones who say /aim, /whatevershot.... /aim makes you stop running, if i'm not mistaken. and, standing still is the next best thing to going prone for getting killed in a hurry.
and yes, "unhittables" do exist, at least in practical terms. at master rifle/master marksman, i was standing still at a range of 50m and missed 9 straight shots on a guildmate who was also standing still. (he was centered, and a defense dabbler). that's close enough to unhittable for my purposes, since if only 10% of your attacks hit, they can regen/stim most of the damage done, and you can't kill them.
-J
BlasterForHire wrote:
XaverriJade7 wrote:
Right, get yourself a nice scoped weapon. For those 'unhittables' (They don't really exist) just lay prone as in this case it's ok (Who would've thought THAT would happen in PvP?!?).
i don't agree at all. most of the defense stackers are TKM, plus Fencer.
Thanks for validation.
going prone in pvp against a melee type is the same as meekly accepting death.
Again, right on.
also, for the ones who say /aim, /whatevershot.... /aim makes you stop running, if i'm not mistaken. and, standing still is the next best thing to going prone for getting killed in a hurry.
Not true. /aim sticks for all specials if standing still. If moving, it sticks for only the next special. Which is why I said to macro it in. Thus you can still kite and /aim.
and yes, "unhittables" do exist, at least in practical terms. at master rifle/master marksman, i was standing still at a range of 50m and missed 9 straight shots on a guildmate who was also standing still. (he was centered, and a defense dabbler). that's close enough to unhittable for my purposes, since if only 10% of your attacks hit, they can regen/stim most of the damage done, and you can't kill them.
Did you use aim? I've never had a problem missing more than 2 or 3 shots when using aim. Might just be me. Oh and I don't use scoped rifles.