Rifleman Archive

Take it from someone who uses both on a regular basis:

TKM does not outdamage a master rifleman.

Rifleman can shoot from 64m, tkm can hit from 5m, + rifleman can outdamage a tkm

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JiveTimeMofo wrote:

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Forsaken411 wrote:
If you use any weapon you get a damage mod applied to it of around 1.5, so If you're using a rifle with 300 min/max, you should shoot normal shots around 450. KD mod seems to be about 1.5x, otherwise TK's would easily hit for 5k. And 4k hits are not uncommon for a TK, because the damage range on knuckles/fists is so tight, so even when you need best case assumptions to make the hit, those ideals are not hard to reach. And yes, that was an uncommon VK, but I recently had one crafted with 188 max dmg pre-slice, it's possible to get a pair that could regularly hit for 4k or more. Used a Nightsister Vibro Motor we looted off Axkva Min.

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thanks for the info! i always wondered how my pistols and rifles hit for more than their rating. i summed it up to critiical hit roll or something.

nice vks! someone on gorath is selling one @199 dmg unsliced. it's going for more than a million last time i looked!

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I used to be a TKM and now I'm a Rifleman. As a TKM I could hit for 2000+ a second with /unarmedhit3, I'm about to master Rifleman and I won't even be close to this - not to mention the insane HAM costs Rifleman incures.

CaleMauddib, if you can't hit that much as a master rifleman, then the problem is you, not the profession....

Also someone posted some tests before somewhere and I believe they concluded the multiplier applied to the base weapon damage is 1.8

With my t21 (powered up 259-684 7.6) i hit a little under aroudn 3.5k on huurtons after AP and resists with HEADSHOT 2. Headshot 2 has a 2.5x damage mod, strafe 2 has 5x....See if you can do the math there. With the above weapon, when i hit master i'll be hitting every 2.28 seconds with the slowest special, strafe 2. Plus i picked up some +5 rifle speed skill attachements, so with strafe shot 2 i'll hit every 1.14 seconds....that is at least untill the supposed nerf comes.

Anyway as people have said, dci321, you can't really compare novice of one professoin to master of another.

And as can be seen here there can be master TKA and master rifleman that suck. It's not just about being the best profession, its about knowing how to use the profession you are...

And another note, whoever thought the damage he posted was what showed up in the combat queue, I don't think 600 damage would be showing up there for the master TKA..

Gorath

Jimral
Currently 4123 rifleman

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I used to be a TKM and now I'm a Rifleman. As a TKM I could hit for 2000+ a second with /unarmedhit3, I'm about to master Rifleman and I won't even be close to this - not to mention the insane HAM costs Rifleman incures.

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Thats odd i hit for 3k-6k every second with no ham costs..... mhhhh maybe cause i am master rifelman for 4 moth now and i konw my proffession.

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DECarbineer wrote:

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Thats odd i hit for 3k-6k every second with no ham costs..... mhhhh maybe cause i am master rifelman for 4 moth now and i konw my proffession.

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Maybe thats because you are either cheating "exploiting" or just trying to make yourselfsound interesting.

The fastest t21 I have has a speed of 5.1 and I consider it VERY fast for a rifle. its not the best dmg rifle I got but it still owns in chaotic dogfights. I paid 50k for that little toy (sorry cant afford millions of creds for rifles that were only obtainable trough exploits a while ago.) so basically what you guys are saying is , if you have a pre nerf rifle then dont cry , go crack some heads your rifle will kick anyones butt but if you dont have the pre nerf rifles then dont bother advancing in the riflemen skill at all.

FYI no I am not a master riflemen but I do have some decent skills (4/4/2/3).

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DECarbineer wrote:

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I used to be a TKM and now I'm a Rifleman. As a TKM I could hit for 2000+ a second with /unarmedhit3, I'm about to master Rifleman and I won't even be close to this - not to mention the insane HAM costs Rifleman incures.

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Thats odd i hit for 3k-6k every second with no ham costs..... mhhhh maybe cause i am master rifelman for 4 moth now and i konw my proffession.

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Please tell me how you get 6k per second on ONE target with a NORMAL rifle when the best i have ever done is 3.5k with a very well made laser rifle with a damage slice and a 33% power up. NO i'm not a master rifleman but i'm NOT qustioning the speed of your attack only the armount of damage. Yes i KNOW adv straft does a lot of damage but only cause of a bug does it hit the same target more than once. NO ham costs you MUST be cheating.

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dci321 wrote:

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DECarbineer wrote:

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Thats odd i hit for 3k-6k every second with no ham costs..... mhhhh maybe cause i am master rifelman for 4 moth now and i konw my proffession.

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Maybe thats because you are either cheating "exploiting" or just trying to make yourselfsound interesting.

The fastest t21 I have has a speed of 5.1 and I consider it VERY fast for a rifle. its not the best dmg rifle I got but it still owns in chaotic dogfights. I paid 50k for that little toy (sorry cant afford millions of creds for rifles that were only obtainable trough exploits a while ago.) so basically what you guys are saying is , if you have a pre nerf rifle then dont cry , go crack some heads your rifle will kick anyones butt but if you dont have the pre nerf rifles then dont bother advancing in the riflemen skill at all.

FYI no I am not a master riflemen but I do have some decent skills (4/4/2/3).

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No he's not cheating, no he's not exploiting, no pre-nerf T21's weren't made using an exploit, he may not even be using a pre-nerf T21, those damage rates are atainable with a laser rifle. I'm not going to go into the details of how to achieve this. Its part of learning your profession, and what seperates the true masters from those that just have the title. You don't need a rare pre-nerf, you just have to learn a little bit about the math of combat, and a few other support professions. I actually posted everything you need to know to do this in another thread, might want to poke around a bit.

FYI anything less than master rifleman isn't decent skills, wait and see.

You need to stop, take a breath, and relax for a minute before you start throwing around charges like this.

With all due respect, the simple fact of the matter is, you simply do not know what you are talking about. There is a reason that you constantly see comments like, "OMG, I just made Master and I cannot believe the difference."Here is the math:

actual speed = weapon speed * special delay * (1 - (personal speed mod * .01))

Ignoring the weapon speed and special delay for a moment, look at the last part of this formula. At Master, you will have a personal speed modifier of 90. Substituting that into the latter part of the formula, you get

(1 - (90 * .01)) = 1 - .90 = .10

That means that no matter what the rifle speed and no matter how long the special delay, a Master Rifleman will reduce that value by 90% and shoot for only 10% of the unadjusted speed. For instance, for a master, your 5.1 speed rifle for a normal attack (i.e., no delay from a special) will be:

actual speed = 5.1 * (1 - (90 * .01)) = 5.1 * .10 = .51

That means a Master can fire your weapon at the one second speed cap for normal shots.

You are correct that you have somegood skills. On the other hand, speed mods are gained mainly in Special abilities, and you are presently at Special Abilities III, so your speed mod is currently only 60. So you are reducing the speed of the weapon by:

1 - (60 * .01) = 1 - .60 = .40

i.e., 60%, resulting in a speed that is 40% of the weapon's normal speed. That would be:

5.1 * .40 = 2.04

This means that, even for a normal attack (i.e., no special delay time multiplier), a Master Rifleman with no tricks orexploits can fire your rifle twice as fast as you can.

Right now, yourhighest damage shot is either Supriseshot or Headshot3, both of which have damage multiplers of 3. Headshot3 has a special delay of 2, and Surpriseshot has a delay of 3. So let's be generous and use Headshot3 for a comparison.

To fire your highest damage shot, the time for you would be:

5.1 * 2 * .40 = 4.08 seconds per shot

For a Master Rifleman:

5.1 * 2 * .10 = 1.02 seconds per shot

Do you see how much the speed modifiers affect you right now? While going from a normal attack to Headshot3 doubles your firing time, it only adds 2 one hundredths of a second (not even noticable) to a Master Rifleman. Stated another way, it also means that a Master Rifleman can fire 4 Headshot3s before you can get off your second. And this is with your rifle, not some pre-nerf or exploitation T21.

As for damage, a Master Rifleman can use Flushingshot2 or Startleshot2, both of which have a 4 times damage modifier, or Strafeshot2 with a 5 times damage modifier. Thus, these shots can do 1/3 to 2/3 more damage than you can with your current best shot, and, by the way, each of those shots are Area Effect shots, so they can do thatmuch more damage tomultiple targets.

Now, a Master Rifleman cannot shoot these shots even with your weapon (as is)at the one second speed cap unless he has Master Marksman and/or some speed tapes. Using your weapon, a Master Rifleman with a +8 speed tape or Master Marksman and a +3 speed tape could easily fire Strafeshot2 at one shot per second. That is a 5 x the damage special at one shot per second with a heavy armor piercing weapon!

So, please, before you start charging that people are exploiting or claiming that they are just trying to make themselves look good, get all the facts. As has been said many times on these forums before, the difference between Novice Rifleman and Master is like night and day. And it is difficult to envision until you reach master. But once you reach master, you can deal out a ton of damage and compete with any profession in the game IF you know how to play the class.