Pistoleer Archive
Thread: Pistoleer Eye Shot
Wow, I get a pet at Master Pistoleer? Sign me up!
Ishpur wrote:
(snip)
2) Sorry MasterPistoleers... I kill you before you can command your pet to attack me.
(snip)
TAH DAH!
I'm may be a jerk but I still make since.
I love how Bounty Hunters seem to cling to this "Skill points" argument. Worshipping at it like a false idol. I've posted this a few times, and here's a repost:
*REPOST*
With that being said, please please please stop whining about it taking 217 points to master BH and 98 for pistoleer. Yes it takes you 2 full trees to master before you can hit bounty hunter, but those are Basic trees that most people master ina matter of weeks.
Here is the biggest indication of why Pistoleers do have a point: The hardest XP to get in the game is Combat XP. It doesn't come in the high bunches of Scouting XP or weapon XP.
BH Combat Experience: 72550 (32550 in Basic and 40000 in Bounty Hunter)
Pistoleer Combat Experience: 442550 (32550 in Basic and 410000)
That is a difference of 370000 Combat Experience or 3.7 Million Weapon experience.
Factor in all your extra scouting and the two extra basic weapon trees it takes you and you still don't reach up to 3.7 million weapon experience.
The kicker to all of this? Lets compare weapon experience:
BH Weapon Experience: 3,873,000 (273000 in Basic 3,600,000 in BH)
Pistoleer Weapon XP: 3,691,000 (91000 in Basic, 3,600,000 in Pistoleer)
Difference: 182,000 Weapon XP or approx 18,200 Combat XP.
Lets subtract that from our current deficit still leaves a Pistoleer with 351,800 more combat XP to get or 3,518,000 weapon experience.
I'll give you investigation 1 for 1 with Combat...I'll admit I don't know how easy it is to get investigation XP. 34000 Investigation XP
That leaves pistoleers with 317800 Combat XP over Bounty Hunters.
Lets take this FURTHER.
I'll give you 1 for 1 Scouting XP v. Combat XP (and lets be honest, Scouting is a lot easier than Combat..but I'm being fair)
Master Scout takes 129000 Scouting Related Experience.
After you factor in that, it still leaves you with
*drum roll*
188,800 Combat XP or 1,888,00 Weapon XP more that it requires to get our 90 some odd boxes compared to bounty hunter.
So please don't come in here saying BH is harder. Granted your class may be a bit borked but for sheer grindability, it takes a hell of a lot more to be a Pistoleer.
*REPOST DONE*
Also don't say that Combat comes with Pistol XP...We require more Combat XP than we do the equivalent pistol XP.
Bounty Hunters aren't supposed to be Combat Demi-Gods. They are supposed to be trackers using wits guile and ingenuity to track targets and get paid. IRL and in game, a Bounty Hunter tha walks up to a mark and thinks he has the advantage should end up dead. The Scout Tree is meant to train the Bounty hunter in tracking their marks, using the land to his or her advantage. The Marksman tree is for the innovative bounty hunter who gets themselves in a jam can pick up practically every weapon and use it with proficiency.
Bounty Hunters in game do not act like the ones in the SWG.
But this goes beyond the BHs....Besides the fact they have such an inferiority complex that they need to come onto the pistoleer boards and complain about how tough their class is every time a discussion is started. This is about Mind Damage being the end all of PvP Combat.
I watched skirmishes last night just to see what was happening. Each time it seemed to be just mind shots and eye shots, bringing down an unhealable bar. It was a race that was normally one by the person who hit firsts.
The complete lack of originality in templates is a direct result in this mind damage issue.
Do we do away with it? No, definately not, but the focus needs to be taken off it to make the game complete and not just an Eye Shot spamfest.
Granted there are some true PvP artists out there that rely on other techniques, and they should be applauded from moving away from the masses.
The issue is now, people are taking Bounty Hunter, getting their few boxes, ignoring the investigations tree entirely and then bulking up with pistoleer or Medic or Creature Handler or whatever.
Fix Mind, make that Eye shot go master and maybe some originality can come back to PvP and to PvP templates.
And to the original question: If something is professed to be overpowerful and/or broken...Don't give it to OTHER classes as a means to balance. And giving us any mind attacks KILLS the rifleman class dead.
if u want to stop a bounty hunter from killing u with eyeshot, go and buy a good composite helmet.
Button you still didnt clarify on the whole eye shot thing.......Many people say hay go get some high resis compo but i cant. While Muon is great i hardly feel that the extra two shots it will take to incap me will make up for my lack of armor. Not to mention with a high krayt Scatter pistol i know it is possible to incap via eye shot in as little as 6 shots..Maybe less depending on their Ham set up. I just want a viable way in game to stop the extra damage im taking to ALL hams not just mind. Btw to all those who will flame about picking a diff race Should Pvp be limited to Zabracks and humans, Commandos and Bounty Hunters? I think now.
Whapleto -Tempest
Pistoler/Medic/Commando/Smuggler
Proud member of Nano Tech Industries.
Personal Shield Generators.
My PvP companions are regularly a human carb/doc, wookie commando (not sure what else he is since he doesn't do anything other than pull out the rocket launchers and take out whole teams at a time), human CM/Teras Kasi (fear this guy), and me.
We do okay.
Yeah lack of armor sucks but I know what special moves cost wookies. A swordsman I play with spends 62 HAM to pull off his swordsman specials. I use over a hundred for my unarmed.
" So please don't come in here saying BH is harder. Granted your class may be a bit borked but for sheer grindability, it takes a hell of a lot more to be a Pistoleer. "
This was the funniest comment I have read. Have you tried investigation line of BH?
That is a grind. In the amount of play time it will take me to grind through Investigation, I could master several elite professions. Average time to go through Investigation is 300+ hours of play time. A mark can take from 30 mins to an hour and a half at worst (and we are not talking about bugged missions where the mark turns up white either), and I get 139 exp. max from that. I need 18,000 for Inv. 4 alone.
Also, your argument of exp. vs skill points does not really compare. I can always get more experience, skill points are finite at 250. That is the point we make when we compare 92 vs 217. Using 92 skill points gives you the flexibility to come up with a lot of combinations that are more powerful than a BH with 33 skill points left over. Some of those combinations were listed in this post.
The other interesting thing is the people you are complaining about for using eye shot are the Master Pistoleer/Expert BH combinations. People that took BH for the pistol bonuses. That template is going to change once eye shot moves to Master BH.
This month's flavor seems to be Commando Flame + Master Pistoleer + Smuggler Pistol line, looks like with some medic thrown in
.
I for one am a bounty hunter who can't wait for them to move Eye Shot to master BH. What I don't want to see is them changing the way the attack works. Take it away from the dabblers. For those of us who do stick with it to master the proffession we deserve the shot.
It takes all but 33 of our skill points to get master BH leaving very little room for dabbling. Most of us use those extra skill points to have a decent pet and enough medical skill to use Bs. So we do not have advanced combat skills out side of BH. The shot works fine its the placement on the skill tree that is the problem and my understanding is that it will be fixed.
For those of us who are willing to grind out the 1.2 million XP in 3 different weapons and about 300 hours of investigation missions deserve to have an attack of that magnitude. As so many people have already posted we can still be taken down. So the attack itself is obviously not imbalanced.
Targus
BH 2/3/2/4
Medic 2/0/3/0
CH 1/1/0/0
Just want to point something out to the BH on this board complaining about skill points:
First off, terrain negotiation isn't worthless in PvP - being able to run up hills is what is called a "terrain Advantage"
Secondly, master marksmen gets you a new ability and increased skills for both pistol and carbine (in case you forgot, both of these are in BH skill tree)
I am a master ranger. It is more point efficient and I get better skills to be a BH with pistol 4, and novice pistoleer, than it is to get master pistoleer. Not to mention I (currently) get eye shot. Plus BSII is better than III and I get the second pistol bleed.
IMO, this should not be the case. Not only do you get better speed and accuracy, you get a better gun cert and better specials. And it takes less to go up your 1 line of pistol that any 1 line of pistoleer.
And pistols are not your only weapon. Spending all of those points should make you good at all 3 weapons, sure. But BETTER?!
Why should someone who spends the xp on getting master pistoleer and master carbines be worse at BOTH than someone with master bounty hunter? Plus you have your scout skills and LLC to boot
Aurore_Wanderhome said:
"Why should someone who spends the xp on getting master pistoleer and master carbines be worse at BOTH than someone with master bounty hunter?.."
You are not. The pistol and carbine skills a BH gets are not superior to the whole pistoleer and carbineer trees.
All BH carbine attacks are position attacks (which are affected by 30secs)and by themselves can not compare to Carbineer attacks or bonuses. Carbineers get better defense, AOE attacks, and more damaging shots. Some of those do not work at the moment, but that is a different issue.
BH pistol line, again, by itself is not superior to Pistoleer. Pistoleers get much better defense and more damaging shots, ability to hit multiple targets etc. Again, some of the defenses and attacks are buggy (from what I hear) and that is a different issue.
The combination of various weapon lines is what makes BH powerful, as we are supposed to take out marks with 10K+ HAM that con red to us. If I were to use solely a single weapon I would not be able to take out my marks, by using all three weapon's lines I do.
This also works for PvP. Well, as I have stated before this combination of skills etc. comes at the cost of 217 skill points. If as a Master Pistoleer you spend the same amount of skill points on a combination of your choosing that is combat oriented, the BH is not at the top of the list then.
Now, if you decide complement master pistoleer with master weaponsmith, no that is not going to work .
"You aresaying thatScouting skills have a use in PvP.ROFL!"
They sure do, but if you don't think so, please try to pvp without it, i'll bleed you and as a ranger you will have no chance of catching me and you will incap and i'll come back and DB you. I can kite anybodyw ith my superior terrain negotiation and only those who've mastered scout have a chance in hell of staying on range to hit me.
Not to bust your chops or anything Button but i really can tell you Personal Shield Generators suck @ss and that is not an understatement....Not to mention they can be worn with armor so if they where any good at all you would see people running around with hi resis compo and a Psg. Btw im planning on going Pistoler 0/0/4/4 and Master smug/ Master Tera so hopefully once def mods start stacking up ill be able to do some damage.....Comando is great but i feel the nerf bat steping up to plate........ One more thing how is it fair that a Wookie bounty Hunter with Bounty Pistol 4 and pistoler 0/0/0/2 should lose to a Zabrack with a Crap compo helm and Bounty pistol 2 with NO pistoler mods..? Just a question.......
Whapleto -Tempest
Novice Medic/Novice pistoler/Novice smuggler/Novice commando/Novice scout
Proud member of Nano Tech Industries