Pistoleer Archive

Here's what I think about the issues:

1. If the speed is increased i'm happy with having Fan shot do cone aoe but otherwise stay the same.

2. MTPS: I like the idea of hitting everything within 32m with decent damage (this is a master skill, it should be powerful).

3. DA1/2 should definitely intimidate. In a perfect game it makes sense to have DA2 be a more powerful version of DA1 however there are some problems with this. If DA2 intimidates more frequently it could cause DA1 to be too weak and worthless. If it just does more damage than it makes DA1 obsolete. I think a simpler solution would be to have the intimidate rates the same but have DA2 be AOE.

4. I agree with Jaegen on body shot 3, bottom line: make it better than BS2.

I can't wait to see my defenses work sometime, that would be great. Also it would be cool to use my dx-2 all the time instead of only using it on special occasions.

Keep up the good work Jaegen we appreciate it.

What we as pistoleers need are:

1. A dizzy attack

2. A intimidate attack

3. Helmets that are AR2 and AR3 because we can't target the mind pool and many others can. Those that can target the mind pool have AR1 or better weapons so our helments are useless.

4. Change the way speed works. Give pistoleers more etc....

These changes would make us somewhat competitive in pvp.

Thanks

Dashai

Jaegen:

I would give them #1 and #3 only.

#2 is dependant upon speed changes, and is confusing because there are so many possible (and needed) speed changes. Would that be #2 is valid if they spread out our speed bonuses instead lf lumping them at master? Or if they give us more speed bonuses so that we hit +90 or +95 also? Or if they fix speed so that it's no longer an exponential, game balance breaking, ability?

Even if we make it clear what we mean by "if speed changes", I'm not confident that they would understand and implement things the way we meant.

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Jaegen88 wrote:

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So here is preliminary based on that, top issues:

1. Only change fan shot if pistoleers are getting an INCREASE in overall speed mod, that is, higher than +74 at mastery.

2. If not, then leave fan shot, and make MTPS a cone attack with good damage/delay.

If you DO increase speed over +74, then folks would prefer fan shot to be cone, and MTPS to be an "all targets in 32m (cap at 10), attack. ?? Both versions had merit, one was good for precise AOE attacks, and this one for all-out everyone attacking.

3. Disarming 1/2 single and cone version intimidate + ok damage/delay. *watch balance on this*

4. Body shot3 (already said this), increase damage to 3.0 orchange both, 2.75 dmg, 2.2 delay. Final DPS should be 1.25 in our opinion. This isn't more than other targeted pool shots.

5. Defense is being worked on folks, they made it too powerful in beta, I can appreciate making slow changes here....as long as they are making them.

6. PBAOE2 needs to hit area of effect.

7. DX2stats and AR still needs to be examined

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To be honest Jaegen , i think the solution into balacing Stopping-shot Vs Fan shot is quite simple. Stopping shot should be the slow attack on speed but very damaging hit at high end. Im talking about 300-650 damage in PVP. (cause PVP and PVE damage on stopping shot are not the same, SS on PVE is 1k+ damage, max now in PVP is approx 200-300 damage)

Fan shot should be the quick shot little damage but quick DPS attack. Basicly those 2 specials should be the inversions of each others. SS= Slow high end damage FS= Quick Low-med Damage

I think the cone idea for Fan shot is ok but not too good, considering we've got enough cone attacks with Disarming 2 and Multi-target-shot atm. Two of the most useless Master Pistoleer skills unfortunately. Iv'e personally had enough with cone-effects up to now I'd like to see more interesting speed single attacks other than point blank single 1 or 2. Fan shot is my winner here and can't wait to see what will be done on this issue. I personally wish the speed + damage would be slighty increased.

Well those were my toughts about splitting the pros and cons about FS vs SS

I don't follow your issues with stopping/fan.

Currently:
stopping shot lowest DPS random HAM over double tap/fan shot, unless you have a 1.0 speed pistol and grab master marksman. I mean, that's extreme, just to make the special higher DPS. Things do not die in 1-2 hits that are worth killing, so high damage/slow, low overall DPS, just doesnt cut the mustard.

Alsol keep in mind, you can already do kip up shot which also does more DPS at lower levels than stopping shot, and the same as fan shot. Sucks IMO.

The change I request is to reduce stopping shot delay, so that it's equal to fan shot. This has the nice effect of leaving the damage "per shot" the same, but it IS slower than fan shot. However, at high levels of speed, it is slightly BETTER than the current fan shot. That's a win win in my opinion, and NOT a huge balance change by any stretch. Frankly, I think it makes sense..you have to combine a good gun with it or master to see the real benefits, but you don't get penalized if you dont have those things.

We will all get tired of what we have, that's inevitable. DA2 doesnt work right now, I dont know, I really don't bother with using fan/stopping alterntatively, always use the highest DPS. Yes, some rare cases where you hit an opponent that is knocked down for a few seconds, but that's not enough to base an entire special off of IMO. You'd probably do better using PMD2 anyway if you fight a carbine/pistol/rifle/commando, you get 50% knockdown + the melee damage multiplier *shrug*

Jaegen i understand your point here about balancing both of em, but as you state , this would make both of those skills similar to each others (damage/speed talking) or am i completely beside the track?

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Jaegen88- wrote:
The change I request is to reduce stopping shot delay, so that it's equal to fan shot

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Basing myself on this sentence that is.

I believe what he means is stopping shot becomes what fanshot is now and fanshot becomes a cone. But this is only a good change if the DPS on stopping shot approaches or exceeds what we get with fanshot right now, as a single target attack.

Uhmmm maybe im completely wrong here, and if i am correct me, but this sounds to me like changing 4 quarters for a dollar.

We get like for like Stopping shot becomes fanshot in DPS and maintains its high damage per single shot. Meanwhile, to have its own niche, fanshot gets a cone. It does less DPS per creature but more overall because it hits more creatures. Just like scouting got reduced to 60% but if you go out in a group of 10 you get 6 times the amount of resources you used to.

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I believe what he means is stopping shot becomes what fanshot is now and fanshot becomes a cone. But this is only a good change if the DPS on stopping shot approaches or exceeds what we get with fanshot right now, as a single target attack.

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Well in that case , yes.... by increasing the DPS on SS i agree... but my meaning is the basic of SSwas meant to be a 1 shot kill incapa strike. In no way it was meant to be quick or whatsoever. Fan shot was intended to be a quick dps attack. This is the reason why i am pushing the logic to go through their basic intended values. Instead of trying to get em close to each others in speed or whatsoever.

Any word on Pistol melee D 2?

But SS and Fanshot won't be close to each other in DPS anymore because Fan is becoming a cone attack. Multiple rather than single target. But we don't want that unless the DPS on SS is increased. That's what we are talking about.