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Thread: Master level missions: a SOLUTION to make everyone happy.
truewildman wrote:
Vicotnik wrote:
That's just it though, this is just your opinion. You can't actually make a master skill box "mean" something special. You really can't. Why?
Because quite simply, the idea that something has some form of meaning based on what is required to achive that thing is pretty much just an opinion. What means something for you, means absolutely nothing for someone else. This whole argument that the master box should "mean" something by making people participate in PVP is flawed at best. How can the master box mean something for someone who actually hates PVP? Forcing them to become a PVP target while doing the missions for the skill box does not mean that said skill box actually means something for them.
I really hate that there's two different threads about this. How about this:
4444 pilots can "master" with app points, like in the ground.
Those who wish to try to "ace" make the choice to PvP, and are subject to the difficult mission.
That gives 2 pilot classes, masters and aces. The aces, of course, would be given the additional rewards of the current master.
First off: Apprentice points would not work, you can't teach pilot skills, so you cannot base it on apprentice points.
Second: The issue is not about wanting an "easier" way, the issue is that not everyone likes PvP. In fact, some people hate PvP more than anything else in this game. Your proposed solution pretty much would tell anyone who's not a PvPer that: "Sorry bud, you're not a PvPer, so you are inferior. But here, take the easy way out". I'm sure most people would want to do the actual mission, they just don't want anything to do with PvP (which some people in these threads absolutely fail to see).
Vicotnik wrote:
truewildman wrote:
Vicotnik wrote:
That's just it though, this is just your opinion. You can't actually make a master skill box "mean" something special. You really can't. Why?
Because quite simply, the idea that something has some form of meaning based on what is required to achive that thing is pretty much just an opinion. What means something for you, means absolutely nothing for someone else. This whole argument that the master box should "mean" something by making people participate in PVP is flawed at best. How can the master box mean something for someone who actually hates PVP? Forcing them to become a PVP target while doing the missions for the skill box does not mean that said skill box actually means something for them.
I really hate that there's two different threads about this. How about this:
4444 pilots can "master" with app points, like in the ground.
Those who wish to try to "ace" make the choice to PvP, and are subject to the difficult mission.
That gives 2 pilot classes, masters and aces. The aces, of course, would be given the additional rewards of the current master.
First off: Apprentice points would not work, you can't teach pilot skills, so you cannot base it on apprentice points.
Second: The issue is not about wanting an "easier" way, the issue is that not everyone likes PvP. In fact, some people hate PvP more than anything else in this game. Your proposed solution pretty much would tell anyone who's not a PvPer that: "Sorry bud, you're not a PvPer, so you are inferior. But here, take the easy way out". I'm sure most people would want to do the actual mission, they just don't want anything to do with PvP (which some people in these threads absolutely fail to see).
I assure you, I don't fail to see that. It seems to me, though, that ones are failing to see the jedi/ace connection.
Your point about the app points is correct. But a purely PvE mission to master should be implemented.
At the same time, don't take away others' wish to truly "ace", since aces are rare, by PvPing, thus displaying their talents. (For the record, I have no such talent. Twitch-based games hate me. I was constantly owned in Quake II.)
But, the need to also PvE at the same time is inherent, since, just as the now banned jedi did, it would be too easy to just say hey, let's go to kessel and kill each other to ace.
Master. (Think master.)
Ace. (Think jedi.)
Mirthain wrote:
Absolute rubbish.
This is the same as any other skill tree. Your payment is not the title, it is equipment usage. Basic equiment for you to RP with.
Mastering in this game is High School. Does anyone complain about mastering the basic skills? Medic, Marksman, Entertainer, Artisanor Brawler? No, those are the basic skills you need to move into the other categories. Do they require PvP? Medic and Ent are the closest with requiring some kind of player contact, but you aren't fighting them, you are helping them.
Pilot is the basic skill tree for the Dev's to build on. None of the basic skills require anything more than making the points. AP/skills. This isa BASIC skill in the game because it has no requirements.
On that same note, most of the skilled trees give you the weapons/ you use without mastering them, the master slot typically allows more advanced specials, not basic equipment with which to use.
And when you master who said that was it? Between helping guildmatesmake thier levels, exploring space and trying to create my own content, I have lots that I can do. I will enjoy having a Multiplayer shipbesides the Ywing. It will make it easier and more fun for my friends that I have made here going to planets for group hunts. Content is not just what the dev's give us, it's what we use ourselves and make it fun.
The problem with PvP for most PvE'ers is the Ganks and (I hate this overused term, but it applies here) "Campers" that sit and Hammer people at HS points. That isn't game level difficult, it is putting us at the mercy of the 13 year old mentaltity that it's fun for me, and screw you crowd.
I have played FPS and flight sims for many years and I don't play most of them anymore because of this group of childish and churlish people.
Don't make a requirement of having to deal with those people if you don't want to. Provide choice to mastery, just like the rest of the basic skill trees.
Talen Konradsson
Zactly what I'm saying.
On Tuesday, we will be seeing some changes here:
Re: Master level missions: a SOLUTION to make everyone happy.
Kessel becomes a PvE zone
Master Pilot Boxes can be attained without PvP
Message Edited by Thunderheart on 11-09-2004 05:11 PM
Message Edited by Cutedge on 11-09-2004 04:17 PM
The PvP aspect was the whole reason I stopped trying to get master pilot. Message Edited by Landorin on 11-09-2004 11:19 PM
Thunderheart wrote:On Tuesday, we will be seeing some changes here:
Re: Master level missions: a SOLUTION to make everyone happy.Kessel becomes a PvE zone Master Pilot Boxes can be attained without PvP Message Edited by Thunderheart on 11-09-2004 05:11 PM
Zoinks! I guess the great wailing and gnashing of teeth got heard.
Thunderheart wrote:
On Tuesday, we will be seeing some changes here:
Re: Master level missions: a SOLUTION to make everyone happy.
Kessel becomes a PvE zone
Master Pilot Boxes can be attained without PvP
I'm sorry to hear that. The last thing most people wanted was to have Kessel be a PVE zone. We wanted to keep it PVP so that anyone who wanted to PVP could go to Kessel or to Deep Space. We just wanted the master mission out of the Kessel PVP zone.
Now, there will be only 1 PVP zone, Deep Space, and you have to be a master to get there. So any non-master who wants to PVP is stuck dueling or going overt and hoping there's another overt around.
Don't get me wrong, I'm very happy that people will no longer be required to deal with PVP while doing the master missions. I just think this is the wrong way to go about it.
I hope this is a temporary fix until you can free up resources to move the mission. Kessel should remain a PVP zone for anyone who wants to go there.