CUEmu - Thread Posts

Bzzzz

Wed Nov 10, 2004 12:31 pm

meeuki wrote:

Hey Kettle, this is Pot!

Whining about whining, kiddo.

Spawn-camping and mission-griefing may have not happened at all on your server (and I'm happy for you and the other residents of the Utopia server), but the mechanic was there, and being used to unfortunate effect on plenty of others. It needed to be stopped. Un-PVPing Kessel may not have been the ideal way to handle it, but at the very least it's an excellent stopgap measure until they can rework the Master missions, end the spawn-camping and add a little skill to player-combat. At that point, I sincerely hope that Kessel is returned to a PVP zone. Until then though, this is a huge improvement.

Upsetting a few spawn-griefers and Corvette Bomb-Strikers is a pretty small price to pay so that the adults can have a little fun.

-Zz

truewildman

Wed Nov 10, 2004 12:34 pm

#28

Bzzzz wrote:

meeuki wrote:Hey Kettle, this is Pot!

Whining about whining, kiddo.

Spawn-camping and mission-griefing may have not happened at all on your server (and I'm happy for you and the other residents of the Utopia server), but the mechanic was there, and being used to unfortunate effect on plenty of others. It needed to be stopped. Un-PVPing Kessel may not have been the ideal way to handle it, but at the very least it's an excellent stopgap measure until they can rework the Master missions, end the spawn-camping and add a little skill to player-combat. At that point, I sincerely hope that Kessel is returned to a PVP zone. Until then though, this is a huge improvement.

Upsetting a few spawn-griefers and Corvette Bomb-Strikers is a pretty small price to pay so that the adults can have a little fun.

-Zz

No one is contesting spawn-camping or mission-griefing anymore. It's no longer an issue. Please stop beating that poor ol' dead horse.

Now, it's about the decision to make Kessel PvE only.

Boslo
-Elder Smuggler/Elder Commando-
Ra'van Crowe
-Elder Smuggler/Elder BH-
I'on
-Pirate-
"You gotta be a little insane to stay sane."

meeuki

Wed Nov 10, 2004 12:45 pm

#29

Bzzzz wrote:
meeuki wrote:Hey Kettle, this is Pot!
Whining about whining, kiddo.
Spawn-camping and mission-griefing may have not happened at all on your server (and I'm happy for you and the other residents of the Utopia server), but the mechanic was there, and being used to unfortunate effect on plenty of others. It needed to be stopped. Un-PVPing Kessel may not have been the ideal way to handle it, but at the very least it's an excellent stopgap measure until they can rework the Master missions, end the spawn-camping and add a little skill to player-combat. At that point, I sincerely hope that Kessel is returned to a PVP zone. Until then though, this is a huge improvement.
Upsetting a few spawn-griefers and Corvette Bomb-Strikers is a pretty small price to pay so that the adults can have a little fun.
-Zz

good point, did you just start reading up on this five minutes ago?

it's been said a number of times that if the developers came out and said "listen, we gotta stop this right now, we'll fix kessel later" that the majority of people protesting this change would be placated. i know i would be. if they said "we want kessel to be pvp, or we want to replace kessel with another pvp area" i'd say "fine". "good". "ok". but NOTHING has been said to indicate that.

see, people are being reasonable about this, it's the people who constantly harp on "griefers!" that aren't. you are missing the point, and just because you THINK kessel will be fixed doesn't mean it will. there's been no indication that it will. there's every indication that the change will be permanant, at the expense of people who enjoy pvp.

what about deep space? what about camping the spawn point there? it's griefing, will that not eventually warrant eliminating PVP in that zone?

true, i may think that the dynamic of forced pvp is needed, but i'm not going to call someone an assh*ole who disagrees. i am going to say that to someone who immediately dismisses the concerns of a sizeable number of peole who enjoyed kessel's original purpose. the point of all these threads is, in fact, that it WAS a less than ideal solution, as you yourself assert. the arguement comes when people drop in and say "good riddance to griefers!" and generalize broadly without even thinking about the issue.

Replicant.NonStopDisco.Kettemoor
Tactic.Ycoto.Kettemoor
ATM.Gorath
make server transfers free you crooks!

Trystim

Wed Nov 10, 2004 12:59 pm

#30

"in fact, not a single solitary post deals with people specifically wanting the right to camp spawn points. so basically you are making something up, and stating it as a fact, whereas i just took a real fact, that there are no posts to back your assertions up, and made you look stupid with it. "

this is exactly what my post described. Instead of just stating your opinion and disagreeing, you had to make sure your

threw in a comment of how my post made me look stupid.

Pvp'ers can declare and PVP anywhere. Do you understand that. Now tell me, can a PVE'er go into deep space and

PVE without anyone being able to attack them? No. Point made. You are complaining that they took something from

you and they really didn't. What they took was your ability to FORCE pvp on anyone you darn well pleased. That's

what all this is about. Your argument concerning them taking a pvp area away is a farce. Because all of the posts pvper's

made before TH announced the change concerned pilot being rare and how it should be hard because players have

to pvp to master it. That was the argument. That was the pvper's entire stance. Now all of a sudden it's about losing a pvp area.

It wasn't about losing kessel as a PVP area before, it was about how master pilot should require pvp to master.

It wasn't about not having anyone to pvp with, it was about you wanting everyone to pvp in order to master pilot.

Now that they gave PVE players their rightful due and put you in a spot where you have to declare to pvp just like

in the ground game, you don't like it. You'd rather just be able to gate other players and be the ones who dictated when

and if someone else mastered pilot and got their reward.

Trystim Niheart

"Greatness is not the gift of majorities; it cannot be thrust upon any man; men cannot give it to another; The place does not make the man, nor the scepter the king. Greatness is from within."

truewildman

Wed Nov 10, 2004 2:01 pm

#31

Trystim wrote:

Since the beginning of the game 'neutral' was NOT

a faction aligned with the GCW. Jump to lightspeed is NOT the GCW expansion. Why do you insist on making

jump to lightspeed about the GCW before the dev's have even had a chance to design and code the GCW

expansion?

Okay, I'm going to type slower so you can understand. The expansion was released as a beginning of change. Neutrals being able to attack and be attackable both sideswas not an accident. This Kessel PvE only change is only temporary. They will continue to let neutrals PvP, as TH stated, there will still be (meaning as it is right now) PvP content for all three factions.

All I'm requesting is htat during this temporary PvE Kessel neutrals still be able to continue to PvP.

My God!!! Can I possibly be any more clear?!?

Boslo
-Elder Smuggler/Elder Commando-
Ra'van Crowe
-Elder Smuggler/Elder BH-
I'on
-Pirate-
"You gotta be a little insane to stay sane."

1000thghost

Wed Nov 10, 2004 2:09 pm

#32

meeuki wrote:

SanRa_Ledav wrote:
Cool, glad to see the DEV's actually listen

listen to whom? you? yeah believe me, everyone who pvp's and cares about a fun GCW is real glad they listen to you too.
they could have fixed it without ruining things for other players. you don't care about that though, do you?

or wait, were you just meaning to troll?

I think you took this all the wrong way bro. However, your Goering quote is frightfully accurate.

Xymox Morningstar
~ Master Bounty Hunter - Carbineer 0,4,0,3 ~
~ Genoharadan Brotherhood~
"If you make out with your sister, You might be a Jedi."

Trystim

Wed Nov 10, 2004 2:15 pm

#33

"you haven't made a single point! all you've said is "you advocated making the mission forced pvp, so you deserve to loose kessel in it's entirety"

how is that a point? all you want is to take something away from someone who has a different playstyle than your own. everyone on this thread is willing to conceed the mission, you however can't even do that, you want the mission, you want kessel, people like you WILL want deep space eventually, you will want overt taken away, you WILL hound the devs to throw in the "second life" source code if you continue to get your way.

it's not in the slightest bit concillatory. that's the difference and the real issue at hand here. at least people are willing to conceed, where you demand your playstyle be accomodated at the expense of others. seriously, i never griefed in kessel. but you should have."

No, I'm holding my stance because it is my opinion that this new 'issue' of kessel being taken away is a smokescreen for pvper's

wanting everyone to be forced into pvp. Here's an example if it was an issue about pvper's 'losing' an area for pvp. Why haven't

they just asked for new pvp areas. Why is the debate around kessel? Do you think that your playstyle is somehow hindered

if your pvp battles were to take place in say 'a hoth' system space with the corvettes, loot, pvp-enabled. etc? Why have you

made it an issue about 'kessel' which just happens to be where all of the future master pilots must go for the mission.

It is my opinion that for the past week, you have gotten a taste of what it's like to kill, defeat, and upset the PVE players that

you feel have 'whined' and ruined 'your' game before and if kessel is allowed to be changed to PVE, you'll have havelost that sadistic

satisfaction. The idea that a region called 'kessel' is being made PVE because the devs have coded the master pilot missions

thereand find it to be a quick remedy to what has happened in kessel over the past week is going to ruin your pvp is a farse.

All you would have to do is ask that a region be made pvp for non-masters that houses some of the same things that kessel

does. There's also an events coordinator named Pex that you can speak with that would help place 'props' in an area and set

the stage for momenutal pvp star wars battles. Instead you are focused on kessel, not PVP. Kessel as it stands at this moment

is the 'perfect' place for ace pilots to go and 'gate' non-pilots from being master and has the perfect roleplay coverup for this

behavior (We're protecting our corvette). That is why I hold my stance and that is why I don't believe you are concerned with

pvp at all, instead you're concerned with being able to 'control' the outcome of a player's mission that YOU think should be rare

and that you DEEM should require pvp to complete.

Trystim Niheart

"Greatness is not the gift of majorities; it cannot be thrust upon any man; men cannot give it to another; The place does not make the man, nor the scepter the king. Greatness is from within."

Trystim

Wed Nov 10, 2004 2:17 pm

#34

Okay, I'm going to type slower so you can understand. The expansion was released as a beginning of change. Neutrals being able to attack and be attackable both sideswas not an accident. This Kessel PvE only change is only temporary. They will continue to let neutrals PvP, as TH stated, there will still be (meaning as it is right now) PvP content for all three factions.

I was speaking with TH when he made the announcement of kessel being moved to PVE. Can you please quote the post where TH stated that

the PVE only change was temporary and that Neutrals were intended to pvp. Perhaps if you made that 'clear' I could review it and change

my opinion accordingly.

Trystim Niheart

"Greatness is not the gift of majorities; it cannot be thrust upon any man; men cannot give it to another; The place does not make the man, nor the scepter the king. Greatness is from within."

Trystim

Wed Nov 10, 2004 2:25 pm

#35

"Okay, I'm going to type slower so you can understand"

Again, an elitist stance where you are attempting to show that I am inferior. You are going to be your own

undoing and statements like this are only proving exactly what everyone has said about pvp'ers in their

posts. I don't agree with you. I don't feel that you've made a valid argument. The elistist believes

that anyone that doesn't agree with him is stupid or inferior you are proving that even in a random

encounter on the forums with a pvp'er thatpvper is an elitist and thus fitting the generalization that

so many pvp'ers are trying to subdue.

Trystim Niheart

"Greatness is not the gift of majorities; it cannot be thrust upon any man; men cannot give it to another; The place does not make the man, nor the scepter the king. Greatness is from within."

truewildman

Wed Nov 10, 2004 2:26 pm

#36

Trystim wrote:

Okay, I'm going to type slower so you can understand. The expansion was released as a beginning of change. Neutrals being able to attack and be attackable both sideswas not an accident. This Kessel PvE only change is only temporary. They will continue to let neutrals PvP, as TH stated, there will still be (meaning as it is right now) PvP content for all three factions.

I was speaking with TH when he made the announcement of kessel being moved to PVE. Can you please quote the post where TH stated that

the PVE only change was temporary and that Neutrals were intended to pvp. Perhaps if you made that 'clear' I could review it and change

my opinion accordingly.

Ask, and thou shall recieve:

Juusman wrote:

Once again the whiners and complainers get their way. Well TH.. I hope you make this mission more difficult then.. at least force people to group up to get it done. But I guess then all the solo PvE artists would be nextin lineto step up and whine and complain...

Couldn't you at least split the mission into two master missions? One for rebels/imps that takes place in a PvP zone, and one for neutral faction players that take place in the PvE zone? That way the players have an option of not having to PvP... and can still obtain the YT 1300 and Firespray.

One the first part, I disagree. It is a great idea, but there are some additional challenges. People with hot boxes have the advantage over PvE players with "not cutting edge" computers and players are getting killed during load times and really, no one likes to get camped, regardless of playstyle. I've talked to a lot of players who are just "regular players" and having a tough time with it.

As far as splitting it into two different types of missions, I dont think that will happen, but we are considering an alternate advancement for the PvP missions. Nothing in stone yet. We are just working on accomodating players who are just trying to get their master box.

Kurt "Thunderheart" Stangl
Community Relations Manager

The PvP missions. Now take that statement along withthe knowledge that they are 1) Progressing toward content, 2) Purposefully coded neutrals into PvP and 3) neutral missions depend on this ability, as well as devs currently coded JTLfuture contentfor all factions, as was mentioned in beta, you get the obvious conclusion.

Boslo
-Elder Smuggler/Elder Commando-
Ra'van Crowe
-Elder Smuggler/Elder BH-
I'on
-Pirate-
"You gotta be a little insane to stay sane."

Trystim

Wed Nov 10, 2004 2:43 pm

#37

I'm glad to see that you posted a statment made by TH, however, you are making your own assumptions concerning that

post and and putting words into TH's mouth that he didn't type. I did not see anything about Kessel being temporary

nor did I see anything about 'Neutral' becoming it's own faction that will act and behave as the existing two factions do.

Let's take a look, because I did say that I would review the post and change my stand 'accordingly'

"One the first part, I disagree. It is a great idea, but there are some additional challenges. People with hot boxes have the advantage over PvE players with "not cutting edge" computers and players are getting killed during load times and really, no one likes to get camped, regardless of playstyle. I've talked to a lot of players who are just "regular players" and having a tough time with it.

As far as splitting it into two different types of missions, I dont think that will happen, but we are considering an alternate advancement for the PvP missions. Nothing in stone yet. We are just working on accomodating players who are just trying to get their master box.

Kurt "Thunderheart" Stangl
Community Relations Manager"

The first portion of TH's statement addresses thesuperiority of certain players' computers over players that don't have cutting edge equipment.

and that no one likes to get camped , regardless of their playstyle

First part: Nothing that states the kessel change is temporary.

The second part TH's is stating that he doesn't think that splitting the missions up is going to happen and that

"but we are considering an alternate advancement for the PvP missions." they are considering an ALTERNATIVE advancement for the pvp missions

Second part: Again nothing stating that the kessel change is temporary or that neutrals were intended to pvp like the existing two factions.

Third part

"Nothing in stone yet. We are just working on accomodating players who are just trying to get their master box."

This is the only area where you might have a point. However, in his statement, TH was unclear whether or not 'nothing in stone' meant that the alternative

for the pvp missions there was nothing set in stone, or in your case, the kessel change was not in stone. He didn't however mention 'kessel' in this post.

He says that they are JUST working on accomodating players who are just trying to get their master box. Again, on my side it is unclear whether or not

that TH implied that work was underway to accomodate JUST the players going for their master box OR that work was also underway to provide

pvper's with alternativepvp mission. Either way, it is 'unclear' using this post by TH that the kessel system is temporary and therefore the post does not

prove your argument. We shall see once TH posts again and clarifies things for BOTH of us.

Message Edited by Trystim on 11-10-2004 01:45 PM

Trystim Niheart

"Greatness is not the gift of majorities; it cannot be thrust upon any man; men cannot give it to another; The place does not make the man, nor the scepter the king. Greatness is from within."

truewildman

Wed Nov 10, 2004 2:48 pm

#38

Trystim wrote:

"Okay, I'm going to type slower so you can understand"

Again, an elitist stance where you are attempting to show that I am inferior. You are going to be your own

undoing and statements like this are only proving exactly what everyone has said about pvp'ers in their

posts. I don't agree with you. I don't feel that you've made a valid argument. The elistist believes

that anyone that doesn't agree with him is stupid or inferior you are proving that even in a random

encounter on the forums with a pvp'er thatpvper is an elitist and thus fitting the generalization that

so many pvp'ers are trying to subdue.

How about this shocker with your stereo-typic view:

I have never PvP'd!! I'm not a PvPer!!

Boslo
-Elder Smuggler/Elder Commando-
Ra'van Crowe
-Elder Smuggler/Elder BH-
I'on
-Pirate-
"You gotta be a little insane to stay sane."

Trystim

Wed Nov 10, 2004 2:50 pm

#39

That doesn't change the fact that you're an elitist.

Trystim Niheart

"Greatness is not the gift of majorities; it cannot be thrust upon any man; men cannot give it to another; The place does not make the man, nor the scepter the king. Greatness is from within."

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Thread: What are the new changes to Kessel, and where can I find a dev post about it?