Doctor Archive

Have you ever heard of stores bumping their prices by 25%, then advertising they have a 25% sale on but all they've done it lower the price to what it was before they jacked it up?

Bear with me here but I feel something similar has happened to our experimentation.

See there is new food out that increases your chances of getting better successes when experimenting. What *I* am thinking is that the dev's LOWERED the formula for successes in the last patch, and with eating the new experimentation food, it just brings it back up to what it was before the "chef patch".

Why do I think this? Unfortunately I never wrote down my successes for posterity (lord knows we should ALL write down every action we do in this game, because it seems to me that from one patch to the next they stealth nerf things and never tell anyone).

But here is the story. I make a full run of Adv Bio's about every 2 days. I sell meds and therefore I'm EXTREMELY picky about what I'll deem acceptable and turn into a schematic. Before the "chef" patch, while wearing my +assembly clothing and in a research city, I could easily expect to see 2 amazing experimentations on an adv bio. I usually wouldn't make bio's until I got at least 3 or 4 amazings. 2 in the power bar and 2 in the charges bar. This sometimes took 10 or 12 attempts to get 4 amazings. I almost NEVER saw a crit fail on bios (due to their low complexity) but saw one about 1 in 8 attempts to make a schematic.

Now, since the "chef patch" that introduced experimentation food, I have tried about 100 attempts to make the same adv bios using the same resources as before the patch. To explain this further, I have tried to make the adv bio schematic at least 100 times since the patch, and I when I experiment I use one point at a time. Therefore I have "experimented" about 1100 times (I have 11 exp pts)

I not only get critical failure more than twice as much, but I have given up even trying to get 3 amazings and if I get 2 amazing successes I glady make the bio schematic now. Where I used to get 2 amazing successes in at least one out of 2 schematic attempts, I am now having to try 15+ times to get those 2 amazings and I have almost never got 3 amazings without a critical messing it up.

In a nutshell it seems to me that the success rate has fallen by about 50%. The number of times I used to get 4 amazings, is now the number of times I will be lucky enough to get 2.

The number of times I crit fail now is at least 3 times more than before the patch. I used to get 3-4 amazings at least once in 10 schematic attempts and I have not seen more than 3 ONCE since the patch, out of 100 schematic attempts.

Has anyone else that consistently makes a great number of schematics, noticed this since the chef patch?

Message Edited by Redfyree on 02-25-2004 05:45 AM

Message Edited by Redfyree on 02-25-2004 05:48 AM

Crit fail currently has a 5% chance minimum (no matter your bonus you have a 5% chance to fail).

It can be more if you are dealing with high complexity and low skill, but 5% is currently the percentage you can't beat.

There was no change to crafting/experimentation in this patch to cause you to fail more.

-T

Yeah i have noticed a higher frequency of crit fails of late (im in a Research city as well )
Now im almost afraid to experiment using 1 point at the time because i almost always get a crit fail then.... Making schematics with more than 2 amazing and the rest great success is what I aim for now as well..... before that was a minimum

"While I am not in a research city, you know how often I get an amazing success? Once in every 20 experiments or so."

Do you mean even on bio's you get an amazing once in 20 experimentation points? Bio's are very low complexity and as I said since using +assembly clothing and in a research city, it was very common for me to get 2 amazing successes in 10-11 experimentation points. I'm not talking about enhance packs or other high lvl meds where the failure rate is huge.

"It can be more if you are dealing with high complexity and low skill, but 5% is currently the percentage you can't beat."

I realize that the chance to crit fail is always there.. my post was comparing "before" and "after" the chef patch results.

All I know is I get crit fails WAY more since the patch and was asking if anyone else noticed a Difference

"There was no change to crafting/experimentation in this patch to cause you to fail more."

And you know this how exactly?? Did you talk to the devs and ask them? Even if you did (and i'm sure you didn't) half the time they make changes, even THEY have no clue it's happened until the affected professions and players tell THEM.. Perfect example the raising of our enhance D's to 90+ med use. Even then it took them 2 weeks to figure out what happened after being TOLD it happened (they had no clue until the doctor community told them) and to report back to us what caused it.

Message Edited by Redfyree on 02-25-2004 07:13 AM

I know because they are changing some crafting stuff for the next patch. Crafting needs some work, and we have been talking about it a lot recently (along with combat). We get told when they change something (though sometimes just not until just before the patch). Not hat wer can often talk the devs out of the change, but we get told.

Because of where the devs were actually working for the last patch (not on the actual crafting code) the chance of a bug being introduced is very low. Next patch, when a Dev will actually be changing crafting code, there could be all sorts of new crafting bugs.

So with no intentional change, and it being very unlikely for this patch to be a new bug, I don't see there being a real change here.

People declare after every singele patch that the devs nerfed them secretly. it doens't work that way in SWG, all nerfs are public (except exploit fixes). The devs take the heat for their choices.

-T

"If they were going to change something like how crafting works, which is a huge integral part of this game, it would be done publicly."

Let me explain that I don't think they "intentionally" changed anything. I do believe that when they are aware of a change and actually program the change, they are good about posting it.

However, there have been numerous times in many professions that a change was made "unintentionally" and therefore undocumented until the affected professions started to question it.

I can think of 2 examples just as a doctor. The bumpage of the med use of Buff D's and the anecdotal evidence of our buffs seeming to come out lower for a great many people (there is a whole thread on this topic).

I ask the people that have posted saying they have noticed no difference to post how often you experiment on whatever it is you make. Have you used the exact same resources on those items from before the patch and after? Have you "experimented" at least 1000 times on that same component before and after? Unless it's something you do a LOT and consistantly, it would be easy to miss any "difference".

If you make many different meds on an occassional basis then *if* there has been a change it wouldn't be noticeable for the most part.

However, like I stated, I could "experiment" 200 times a day on the SAME component so judging by a month before the patch and the many thousands of experimentation pts I put into bios, and AFTER the patch, I have noticed not a small possibly misleading difference but rather a HUGE difference.

Bio's are easy to judge this by. When I make enhance packs the difference (if there is one) hasn't been noticable to me since the failure rates on them is already so high and random to begin with. The fails or successes on ACDRMs or ALS or ASDS also hasn't made me sit up and notice simply because I cap on those easily and therefore I don't put the time and effort into the experimentation process that I do with Bio's.

However, since I and many others are not seeing this at all it isn't a hit to the system as a whole. It may be because you wear a red hat, or use a certain kind of craft station... Maybe you are getting more fails, but not all of us are.

Stealth nerf means they did it on purpose without telling us. These words have meaning in context. CAlling it a stealth nerf could never be an accident.

The med use thing on packs was acused by an actual fix we reqested (basically the md use on the packs was experimenting backwars low to high). That fix wasn't a secret or stealth move either. It was announced. It had side effects.

You post saying "stealth nerf" and you will get replies based on what you said. Gotta be careful how you phrase things.

-T

I agree that IMO nothing has changed. I don't use the food as I haven't found any yet though.

About the experimentation changes next patch personally I'm mostly worried about it...