Doctor Archive
Thread: Dev Clarification on why buffs are the way they are on LIVE.
And it's not just some formula that people concocted, that's the formula the game uses for buffs. And it seems to me that a lot of docs don't know about these pointers I posted, because up until a few days ago, the boards were still alive with threads about "Does BE clothes *really* work??". And from the posts, many docs still believe BE clothes don't work, and many have never heard of bivoli Tempari. So getting good buffs appears to be a secret that many docs still have to learn.
Message Edited by Lexy on 03-02-2004 12:06 PM
Lexy wrote:
Actually, that's a flat out lie. The patient had at least 200 BF if that happened. A 927 kit, with a droid and just BE clothes will yield a LOW buff of 1147. With Bivoli Tempari, the low buff is 1274. Hitting for 950 under the conditions I listed is mathematically impossible.
You're obviously in support of the change because don't know how to use your kits to get the best buffs possible. Give me your kits, and I'll never hit below 1274. You just can't let people with 400 Battle Fatigue talk you into buffing them, thus hitting a 950 with your kits.
Create a char on Gorath and we can do some tests. I am dead serious. Buffs with these packs are all over the map. I have hit for as low as 940ish, and as high as 3600 with the same packs
I still think that droid charge effects the buff. A lot of people say droid charge has two stats charged or not, but it seems to me best results come right after I give the droid some new batteries.
Songe wrote:
Lexy wrote:
You're obviously in support of the change because don't know how to use your kits to get the best buffs possible. Give me your kits, and I'll never hit below 1274. You just can't let people with 400 Battle Fatigue talk you into buffing them, thus hitting a 950 with your kits.
Because you use a formula that other people posted and apply it doesn't mean that you know better than the others. I'm pretty sure that most of us do know how to buff (I mean... it's part of our job). I have some news for you though, in most conditions you just can't afford to ask whoever you are buffing to go get rid of their BF first. Well unless you don't mind being rude of course.
I have never hesitated to refuse to buff someone that had over 200 BF. Most of those have been grateful for me pointing out an element that would reduce the buff strenth. I've had a few say "I know, I don't care, buff me anyway," so Idid.
After all, the customer is always right. ("...and we must make him pay for his arrogance!," Dogbert)
This is a massive nerf for the high end docs, and a blessing for those who still haven't learned the buffing system.
A 3700 health, 1500 strength, 3900 const is better than 2400 across the board. Any day.
Lexy wrote:
You can only hit for 3400 Matchstick? You made my point exactly
This is a massive nerf for the high end docs, and a blessing for those who still haven't learned the buffing system.
A 3700 health, 1500 strength, 3900 const is better than 2400 across the board. Any day.
Look little girl. Feel free to come to my server and do better with our resources.
Jesus... the attitude from this one.
Like I said.
Do 100 buffs pre-publish... average your results.
Do 100 buffs post-publish with the same conditions and average your results.
When you see that they are the EXACT same number.... then tell me about nerfs.
And... is a 1500 Health, 3900 Strength, 1600 Constitution as good as a 2400 across the board? Answer me that. Because THAT is the one I'm tired of. Christ... see that green pair of words under my sig? The ones that says, "Jedi Initiate"? I rely on my buffs to do 250K Jedi XP a day (That's about 2 million regular xp for you non jedi's). Getting a **edit**ty health or constitution is dangerous for me and I'd MUCH rather have consistancy.
So what you really want is a buff overwrite system, right? But wait, we got that. So why do you want to nerf buffs again?
I think what folks are saying here, Lexy, is that if we completely follow the conditions you are listing we'll never get below 1200, but that 1200 is still too friggin' low when those same packs under those same conditions easily hit for over 3k as well. The numbers end up all over the place. But, if you buff under those same conditions under the new method, you'll still have better buffs than anyone who doesn't follow the conditions you mention, and you'll never even have to worry about a 1200 buff anymore, either.
But, yes, the 3k+ buffs won't show up. No 1.2k, no 3.4k, but you do get the middle ground value that you had ALWAYS been buffing for all along when you average ALL of the buffs you have ever done under those conditions together. Not to mention, everyone elses buffs won't be hitting for 3k, either... then again they won't hit for 1.2k. It doesn't matter what the low end number is, really, because no matter how you look at it compared to the high-end number you are getting it just ends up being the same painful result comparatively. Heck, since it's a multiplier that makes the range at the higher levels with all the modifiers even more pronounced in straight numerical value.
So in the final analysis the variation removal is not, in and of itself, that big of a change. It just makes buffs understandable as to what they do under what conditions.
Now it would definitely be a nerf if they had implemented the buff overwrite code first and THEN said "Oh no, now everyone is buffing each other 3 and 4 times a stat to make sure they always have buffs over 3k! We have to do something about that so lets remove the variability so they can't do it anymore." If that had happened, that would certainly be a nerf. In this case they are doing both.
Are there better options? Yeah, I think there may have been. My personal preference, and the one from the polling I had done, would be for keeping variability, but reducing the amount of variability we are dealing with. Overwrite doesn't even need to be implemented at all if buffing required /consent or being grouped with whomever you wish to buff.
Lexy wrote:
Ah, so you're one of the hologrinding docs, no wonder you don't get good buffs.
So what you really want is a buff overwrite system, right? But wait, we got that. So why do you want to nerf buffs again?
Matchstick has been a MD on our server since before I started playing. That was long before the Great Holocron Patch. I think he might just know about being a doctor.
Ruda Erev, Naritus
Lexy wrote:
Ah, so you're one of the hologrinding docs, no wonder you don't get good buffs.
So what you really want is a buff overwrite system, right? But wait, we got that. So why do you want to nerf buffs again?
Nope.. was a Doc for 3 months before ever attempting a Holocron.
Bought a whole seperate account to do the Jedi thing. That's the Commando/Ranger under my sig. The Doc/Combat Medic was in place long before.
I also run a business that pulls down about 4.5 mil a week. Have for months. I could do more business... but that would take away from my jedi time.
Thanks for playing... but obviously you're as wrong about my capabilities as you are about the buff issue. 
Lexy wrote:
A 3700 health, 1500 strength, 3900 const is better than 2400 across the board. Any day.
But what you don't say is that 2400 across the board is better than 1500 health, 3700 strength, and 3900 const... it's not always the secondaries that get with that low buff.
And if you are hitting 3900 (implying a current range of at least 1300 to 3900), then the new buffs will not be 2400, but 2600 at a bare minimum.
With missing materials stats not being counted (this has been confirmed by the devs), we can maximize out crafting pretty easily with good materials.. most other crafters (for example chefs) will ahve 3-4 materials lowering their crafting vlaues in any category... We can make sure we ahve good OQ and Good PE on 1 material, and good OQ and good UT on another, and skip a lot of the new problems, since the PE and UT missing stats are skipped.
We come out of this new crafting change with quite a better position then every other crafting profession.
-T