Carbineer Archive

My original post was on a way to make BH more balanced and useful at the same time(im BH also). Im sorry, if you seen other posts of mine, ive been very clear on the usefulness of the carbineer as a whole and i do think a carbineer is better than a BH. however, it is beyond argument that BH has better accuracy and speed which is the core of any ranged profession. those 2 factors form the core of a ranged profession. my point was merely to change BH to further compliment a true master of a weapon such as carbineer or pistoleer. While i dont think Master BH is better than carbineer, if both go prone and both are shooting at a target, the BH will hit more often as a example and i think a BH with no carbine skills ahouls not be a better or even equal shot to a master carbineer when theyve spent no points in it at all.

Sorry omin, but if you think this is just another rant, then your just not reading. i offered a solution that is benificial to both carbineers and BH that would balance out the profs a bit more and help to create a bit more versatiliy in character builds. however, since you either dont read the entire post or just dont care, i can if you like, write up a full blown rant devoid of any logic or helpful suggestions for you to sit and tear on.

i didnt say accuracy and speed is everything, i said its better with master BH which no matter what you say, you cant contest that fact. viability in combat is a entirely different matter.

Uh, you're arguing that the BH replaces the Carbineer because it has an extra +5/+5 skill mod?

o.O

Do you actually understand how little that is? /sigh

>BH with no carbine skills ahouls not be a better or even equal shot to a master carbineer when theyve spent no points in it at all.

Eh? The only skill mods a BH gets are from the Carbine skill tree and a +10 accuracy bonus at master.. that costs 150/250/350/450k xp to get, the skill points associated with that .. really get the feeling you haven't actually got a clue what you're talking about

this is fact:

if you have a Master Bounty hunter and a master carbineer both lay prone at shoot at a target x meters away with the same exact carbine, the BH will hit more often than a carbineer will. my point was simply that it should not be this way. A BH should not be able to have equal or superior skills at hitting a target.

I dont know what your bitching about really. Im saying a BH should not be as skilled a marksman as a carbineer(which if they are still and shooting at a target, they are able to hit just as often). Your making it sound like im trying to say BH is better than carbineer. Im simply saying BH overlaps too much bith carbineer skills and pistoleer skills. Theres nothing negative about my post toward carbineer or BH.

"Uh, you're arguing that the BH replaces the Carbineer because it has an extra +5/+5 skill mod?"

no, once again youve failed to grap the concept, congratulation. its not how much they are better, its that they are better at all.

">BH with no carbine skills ahouls not be a better or even equal shot to a master carbineer when theyve spent no points in it at all.

Eh? The only skill mods a BH gets are from the Carbine skill tree and a +10 accuracy bonus at master.. that costs 150/250/350/450k xp to get, the skill points associated with that"

once again, youve failed to graps the concept, all that staement did was explain something that we all know already. BH has slightly better accuracy and speed, you get points as you progress up the tree and it costs skill points. thank you for your ground breaking information.

"really get the feeling you haven't actually got a clue what you're talking about "

as your points make little sense, you obviously dont read the posts and youve yet to add any helpful suggestions on how to fix the current situation, i think its unwise to call other people clueless. when you actually add any value to a discussion, then maybe you can talk. i was posting a suggestion to fix a problem and you jumped all over me. you dont like my ideas, then dont read my post. eh?

Bottom line...

A BH uses so many of their points getting there that they can't be much else. Therefore ALL of there power in offense has to come from that line. Also, if you think about it your average storm trooper would get owned bya bobba fett type bounty hunter. I understand that right now BH's hunt NPC's, but the whole idea is that they can take a person down. I would think that that should also include PVP. A carabineer can take all kinds of other professions. A carabineer can use those extra points to have pets, or a million other things. Considering that BH takes 3x the skill points, it really should be more powerful than carabineer.

I mean a BH should really be an offensive combat specialist right?

ok, i think its fairly obvious that this "whos more worthy" discussion is going nowhere. what we the community need to do is think up solutions. we need to find a way to make BH have a distinct and unique set of abilities tied into combat, all the while making carbineer really shine at its abilities due to it being master of that weapon.

on a personal note, i think the DEV giving straight out combat abilities that could replace a regular weapon class was a incredibly dumb thing to due, you could easily see where this was going to end up. I think a new BH prof(yes, im a BH also, so i realize im changing myself) should be all about additions in combat, not replacements. You should have droid certifications, special weapons/items/armor certifications available only to a BH, certain abilities perhaps like the ability to hide and not show up on other people radar allowingsuprise attacks, and bounty hunter special moves, perhaps the ability to progress up a BH tree and reduce the cost of wearing armor in HAM costs, etc.

These kind of things make the BH a valuable combat class but no not replace a mastery of a weapon, which to me only makes sense. I mean, a BH of all people has to be extremely proficient in weapon skills and BH would go even further than mastery allowing them special abilities and unique privelges....but it simply would not replace it.

Also, the BH needs to have its requirements toned down a bit in conjunction with this. Rather than master scoutmarksman, i say novice marksman with Ranged 4(after all that combat xp, you have to be competent in something) and novice scout with explore 4 and MAYBE survival 4. That i think would reflect the value of this skill a bit more appropriately as its not a complimentary profession instead of the end all profession all by itself.

So, in the end, a master carbineer with all those BH "perks" would be a master of combat second only to jedi just as the devs have stated and the BH want, but they would not replace the carbineer as the core foundation of any combatant using carbines. A BH without carbineer would be completely outgunned against a master carbineer in this situation. I dunno, i think its a idea that needs some polishing from the community, but its a idea non the less.

Thing is BH doesn't replace Carbineer, at all.

BH has some nice skill mods and a knockdown attack, their other carbine attacks are useless...

The skill mods are nice but only about 5-10 points more than master carbineer and when considering its their only attack line for that weapon and they're unable to pick up any other profession realistically, those 33 points have to go into medic.

Other than that attacks like Scatter Shot II, Burst shot, FA area etc. all own, especially when they're fixed.. Action shot 2 is probably one of the best specials in the game imo.

The idea of 1 knockdown attack and some skill mods replacing the Carbine profession is just laughable.

well i dont know where you get your info, but BH has better accuracy and speed at master than a master carbineer does. they have 2 very nice knockdowns and confusion shot, non of which are useless. and yes, in case you havent noticed, everyone seems to think BH can replace carbineer and i dont think that viewpoint is completely without merit. The best way to balance this out is not have BH give accuracy and speed mods, but to give them special abilities and perks as such to make a master of carbineer or pistol even more effective. I think that any serious combat class should have to master a weapons skills such as carbineer rather than to totally skip it and still be extremely dangerous in combat (pvp or not).

this is the whole thing, im not and never have said BH is better than carbineer as a whole. i think rather that BH overlaps too much with carbineer. I AM A BH ALSO, so im not saying nerf BH, im just saying id rather have bh give unique bonuses to combat such as armor stat reduction, special moves, etc.....but i think basic marksmanship stuff like accuracy and speed should be in the weapon profession. im not saying weaken BH, just change it to where its a more unique and IMO a more useful profession. i really thing BH and carbineer should compliment one another rathen than compete as they tend to do to a degree..

They can't, BH have 33 skill points at the end of it so the only way that would happen was if the requirements were reduced significantly, thats not gonna happen because SOE wanted to make BH somewhat exclusive and try and get only people that were 100% set on being a BH and only a BH...

BH skills don't overlap, they have decent combat abilities because they need it because they haven't got the skill to spec in anything else but Carbineer far surpasses it, has all the skill abilities that the BH does so if anything Carbineer replaces BH...

Oh and again whining over +5/+5 modifiers is just pathetic considering its a BH's only combat abilities for a combat class that spends 217 skill points as apposed to 72 odd.

Why you think a profession that costs 217 skill pts should be inferior to one that costs LESS THAN HALF, let me know.

The BH is decked out because their level 1 "easy" marks have 10K HAM and can potentially kill them in under 5 shots.

They need every bit of offensive power they have to take down their marks.

Not everything revolves around PvP. All the people crying "nerf th BH" seem to think that, without realizing that some people BH for the Bounty Hunting. Not to grief and 0wn n00b d00dz in PvP.

Charge shot is a knockdown and is better than underhand shot, so whats the problem? A Master Carbineer has a knockdown thats better than the BH knockdown. Unless you want to make knockdowns exclusive to Carbineers I don't see the problem here.

All of these noob carbineers who haven't traiend for charge shot yet are whining about underhand shot just because they saw that used first. Get some combat exp, get charge shot, and then come back and try to say BH carbine is better.

Stop making assumptions based on things you read, get to Master Carbineer and then compare. A Carbineer with charge shot can do EXACTLY the same thing a BH does with underhand, and charge shot knocksdown more often than underhand vs NPCs.

PvP is all about who fires first.

Master Pistoleer, has ranged AoE knockdown

Master Carbineer, has ranged knockdown and AoE knockdown

Master BH has ranged knockdown

Master Rifleman can 1 shot most people, so knockdown is not necessary.

Get to master, try out the AoE knockdown, theres no way you'll say a BH is better.

Pistoleer has melee knockdown too. Carbine and Pistoleer masters get 2 forms of knockdown each, not just 1 like a BH.