Carbineer Archive
Thread: When is the HAM cost fix coming???
The announced HAM cost fix is coming with the big July patch announced under the "under development" section of the SWG homepage.
Anyone know if those fixes have been moved to Test Center already?
I am a Rodian (Artisan although I migrated stats immediately to Scout on the station). I picked up Scout and Marksman out the door in Kor Vella. My Action pool regeneration is so good I can play music non stop, and I hardly lose Action when I fire my DH17 (regular). Health is the issue. I have also looked at several E11 Carbs that have been for sale. All kill me in health costs. The majority of the mobs I fight predominantly decrease the health pool most. Depending on what I want to do when I fight I either use pure carbine or soften them up with a rifle first. The 2 specials I use are Leg shot 2 and Full Auto. If I go pure Carb, I usually soften them up with a Lecapine Dart first or other traps and then LS2 them till they drop. If I rifle them first I will usually decide what to use depending on what pool is lower when they charge. Needless to say, I am not impressed at all with what the Carbines do. The damage output is fine but the cost for me is huge. If I wasn't raising the Carbine skill for Carbineer profession, it would be a waste of my time. I can just as easily Use this combo more efficiently when soloing white/blue.
I mask scent.
Stop prone at 64 m.
(Tusken Rifle Equipped) Aim, headshot, headshot.
Equip DLT20a Headshot, normal until they charge within 45.
Equip DL44, kneel, fire normally.
---Six out of ten times I don't even use the DL44. And very rarely do I get hit. Now I can take on most yellows with minimal damage but if I use a carbine, my health pool is less than half (out of 800). That just sucks frankly. To that end the higher end Carbines might eliminate these costs but at mid level The DH17 and E11 carbs will prevent too many people from even trying to complete the Carbine skill tree. Especially when lower level, you have a large pool of skill points to play with and experiment with what you like. Rifle and pistol will be more attractive to the masses, meaning less carbines being made, making them more expensive and making Carbineer harder for everyone. I am on Corellia right now and if you just look at the bazaar, there are no Carbines above E11(and the E11's are garbage) and the Rifle and Pistols available are of a higher caliber and quality. Why stick with a DH17 when I can buy a Rifle or pistol that does more damage per fire rate, has less HAM costs and has better range modifiers.
When in a group I hardly ever do any special attacks because of cost and therefore I lose out on XP because i do a much smaller portion of the total damage.
It has been a long time since we were promised the fix.
What fix were we promised, though? Just the stock HAM fix, as asserted, or a HAM cost overhaul for the Carbineer class in general?
heres what im really curious about and i havent seen a concrete answer yet.
is weapon experimentation the core problem with carbine HAM issues or is it the guns themselves by design?
if it is weapon experimentation then why can weaponsmith make awesome pistols and rifles?
is the experimentation problem striclty exclusive to carbines?
i posted this in the weaponsmith forum and didnt get any kind of real answer.
if someone could answer this, id include a pray for it to rain down beer and steak in your house tonight.
sehkmahBH wrote:
heres what im really curious about and i havent seen a concrete answer yet.
is weapon experimentation the core problem with carbine HAM issues or is it the guns themselves by design?
if it is weapon experimentation then why can weaponsmith make awesome pistols and rifles?
is the experimentation problem striclty exclusive to carbines?
i posted this in the weaponsmith forum and didnt get any kind of real answer.
if someone could answer this, id include a pray for it to rain down beer and steak in your house tonight.
Well, the beer I could take or leave, but steak sounds great, so I'll give it a stab.
I'm a weaponsmith, and I tend to think that it's the carbine schematics themselves. Even with buggy stocks (ie, 25/25/25 HAM stocks), the stuffI have to start with on a rifle are much more reasonable than what I get out of a carbine. I make DH17s that are like 52/57/49ish, but a DLT20 (same tier) is 40/45/53 or some such, before experimentation. I don't have a lot of success decreasing HAM on much of anything (basically, a point or soper experimentation point I dump in, that's even on CDEFs), but I think that might just be by design -- the intention is to experiment down HAM on components, as you get much better bang for the buck on damage on the final combine. But it seems clear to me that similar carbine recipes (ignoring the vanilla every-type-of-CDEF-has-identical-stat-ranges bit) yield a base HAM of 10-20 total HAM points higher than a rifle.
I think some of our HAM issues come from both the way all Carbines seem to have higher than other weapon HAM costs across the board and how the game applies these costs under the covers. Here is an example of three specials taken from the SWG Resource Center database:
Move Name: LegShot3
Weapon Type: Carbine
Targets Affected: Cone
Area Cone Length:
Area Cone Width:
Time Modifier: 2
Damage Modifier: 3
Health Cost: 0.5
Action Cost: 2
Mind Cost: 2
To Hit Mod: 25
Move Name: BodyShot3
Weapon Type: Pistol
Targets Affected: Single
Area Cone Length:
Area Cone Width:
Time Modifier: 1
Damage Modifier: 4
Health Cost: 0.5
Action Cost: 1.25
Mind Cost: 0.5
To Hit Mod: 50
Move Name: HeadShot3
Weapon Type: Rifle
Targets Affected: Single
Area Cone Length:
Area Cone Width:
Time Modifier: 2
Damage Modifier: 1.5
Health Cost: 0.5
Action Cost: 0.5
Mind Cost: 2.5
To Hit Mod: 50
Compared to pistol we get pulverized under the covers the total Multiplier onBodyshot3 summing it all up is 2.25, Mindshot3 is 3.5 and Legshot3 is 4.5. As you can see it does not matter what the stats on the gun read we are going to be burning more HAM than Rifle or pistol users using our special moves. I used these moves for as best I could get a like comparison.
I like Carbine a great deal, I have BH Carbine IV and am a Master Carbineer, I can really roll out damage but the HAM costs if I use many specials will kill me. Knowing what I know now, I almost wish I had gone the pistol route, which is sad. Hopefully they will revamp the carbine special costs across the board and address the HAM costs on the weapons a bit.
I feel the carbine is superior to the pistol so I can accept it requiring a bit more HAM to use, but my Knockdown in the Bounty Hunter line costs me with my stats as they are 111 (The numbers over my head) and my buddy's pistol whip costs him 31. He basically can run 3.5 specials that hit at about 85% the power of my one shot so in reality he is out me by almost 3 to 1 based on HAM costs, not to mention the mob has been knocked down 2 additional times.